Hay equip. where to start?

[jbaker]

I am realy considering buying my own hay equipment to cut and bale my own hay. I have almost 3 acres of hay ground. I am new to this but can learn.

So I guess I need a tractor with sickle bar and 540 pto, a rake, and a baler.

Is there more?

next question, what size tractor? does not have to be IH but prefered. I have my eye on a farmall c with trip bucket and he has a sickle bar that once was on it.

Now what size rake and baler for small sqaures?

 

[thoffman]

"Is there more".............Well you will need $$, $$$ and more $$$$.

 

[jboelens]

Jeff, the C will cut the hay, but then you'll need a bigger tractor to bale with.

Here's our baling outfit. My uncle's Farmall Super M, and his steel wheel IH rake. and there's my IH 37 baler that we square bale with. We have the hay custom cut to keep that cost down of owning/storing/repairing a haybine. Although this year we will be using my IH 560 for baling sinc it has Live pto and T/A.. something my uncle's Super M doesn't have.

 

[jboelens]

Hmmm. I'll try again.

 

[jbaker]

So a C is not big enough to run a baler ?

 

[fcurrier]

I'm wondering:
How many bales can you get from 3 acres? (40 pound bales)?
Do you get 2 cuttings/year?
What's a 40# bale sell for in the Ridott area? (running about $3/bale here).
Does someone in your area hay for hire?

Tom had a pretty good answer.

Or...(be honest, now, we won't tell your wife) does Jeff just want that C?

 

[jbaker]

Here's the deal, I have a guy about a mile away that can custom cut,rake,bale..$45 an acre and .25 cents per bale (last year prices)BUT this is when he has time which normally happens after my hay gets past its growing prime and twice a year.

To buy hay,, all grass hay starts around $4 a bale, bale weights are 35lb area and alfalpha climbs to as high as $10 but is normally around $6 to $8 and bale weight around 45 to 50.

My record cutting for 3 acres was 220 bales average is about 120 per cutting,,,I could get 3 to 4 cuttings if I can get him over there. And with a reseeding and fertalizing, if timed right I think I could average 140 bales 3 to 4 times a year.
Plus it can be cut at the correct time. We grow alot of clover in it and that needs to be timed for optimal taste and nutrician.

Currently I use about 400 bales a year.

So if I can pick up what I need for under 4 to 5 grand, it wont pay for it self the first year but after 3 or 4, it should.

She is the one that likes the C

because it has a manure trip bucket on it

 

[jgoodine]

Jeff if I had even the smallest excuse to buy a big brother to my cubs and bale some hay, keep some old equipment out of scrap yard, I'd go for it. Last I checked there was no money in hobby farming anyway, it's just getting out there and enjoying it, kinda like a garden, If I counted my time, I don't think it makes much sense to grow one, but I do it,

 

[pfunk]

Jeff, I would agree that a C is not big enough to handle a baler. And, I'd add a "live" or "independent" PTO to the list of things to get on a tractor. It's handy for mowing and a must for baling in my opinion. I've baled without it, but it can be a pain. And, personally, I think New Holland makes the best square baler out there. You should be able to pick up a used one reasonable.

 

[jbaker]

so the same guy has a decent M, will that be enough to run a baler??

start throwing out some model numbers of smaller tractors I should look for...

 

[mhomrighausen]

Just my thoughts. A good FARMALL H or Super H will handle a baler only not quite as well as an M or Super M. A 400-450 will have the TA for slowing down without shifting in the heavier areas and live pto. Same with a 460 which is pricier.Advantage of live power pto and hydraulics is when you find a good used loader (try a salvage yard besides the local classifieds for a loader) with the hydrualic bucket for snow removal.

Allis Chalmers WD45 is a pretty darned reliable little tractor and pretty reasonably priced. Only drawback is the hydrualic pressure is different if I recall correctly. So is an AC D17 or 19 Series tractor... reasonably priced and nice power.

I think the Oliver 880 has live power and pto. Another good old tractor.

Finally a Massey Ferguson MF65 or 165. Really nice tractors and even have aground speed pto. Differential lock for winter snow removal, power steering (loader), CAT 1 three point is standard. After my Dad passed away we leased/purchased a MF65. Best baling tractor I've ever used.

Again just some thoughts.

 

[jlspicer]

Jeff,
I wouldn't look for anything smaller than an M. Maybe you'd get lucky and find one with an M&W hand clutch giving it live PTO. I'd look for an M, Super M, 400, 450, 460 or 560. A 560D would be the perfect small baler tractor. Live hydraulics and PTO. Sips fuel. You might be able to find a decent, nice running one for $2000 or so with a standard drawbar and no fenders. Lots of older IH balers out there. You might get lucky and find an older one that's been in a shed for decent money. Live PTO is almost a must in my book. Everytime you hit a tough, thick spot in the windrow that bogs the baler, when you push the clutch to slow down/stop, the baler stops.....Thats why most of the older tractors like M's and such used on balers had M&W and Heisler hand clutches to give them live PTO.

 

[dfrisk]

JEFF -Dad & I baled 20 acres of alfalfa hay,2nd or 3rd cutting with my Super H on the IH #37 baler one afternoon. No live PTO on the Super H and it was NO problem... even in some hills pulling a loaded hay rack... you just have to re-learn how to rake hay, small windrows, not the BIG monsters I raked when the neighbor had a #55 IH baler with the C113 CID IH engine on it, meaning I could clutch & stop anytime and the baler kept running.

ANYHOW...buy a RED baler... with yellow wheels, New Holland, I've NEVER heard anyone complain about a New Holland baler. The newer the better, but will be more money. IH balers tend to have fussy knotters, they waste a TON of time.

Any rake should be fine, a New Holland,IH, New Idea, Dad had a David Bradley (Montgomery Wards), about a 1950's vintage that worked fine... my Brother-in-law still uses it, His Dad bought it at My Dad's auction. Unless you get a wheel rake, the basket or parallel bar rakes all take a 7 ft swath.

An H FARMALL would be marginal running a PTO baler, but my Dad baled tens of thousands of bales with a '47 H & IH Cub engine driven #50T baler from 1947 to 1951, did custom baling down in Henry Cty. A Super H sells at a premium, especially a Stg II w/live hyd. An M would be a good baler tractor, also a Super M, and the faster gear speeds of the Super M & newer tractors would be better for mowing & raking. A Super M-TA also sells at a premium, but a 400 or 450 would be good, also have live PTO, probably power steering, would burn more gas, I'd stay away from the diesel versions that start on gas, run on diesel. A 460 or 560,even the diesels would be good too, or a 504, 544, or a 656.

The last built IH sickle bar hay mowers were good, they built a trailing mower, model # 1300,most parts are still available under a different brand name, think maybe Howes, or something. I've mowed with everything from a '39 H, '54 Super M-TA w/live PTO,live hyd, & Power Steering, & my '54 Super H w/live hyd & no live PTO. The Super H is/was the best mowing tractor, the SM-TA the worst when the sickle bar plugged up, and the '39 H took the most work to clear the plug, took something like a dozen pushes on the clutch. The SM-TA & SH both mowed @ 6-1/2 MPH, 7 ft swath, right at 5-1/2 acres per hour with no stops. The H @5 MPH, & 4-1/4 acres/hr.

The hay rake & mower should be fairly cheap to buy, they're old technology, everyone uses haybines & disk mowers now, the baler,not so cheap for a good one. You really need a place to store the baler & mower out of the weather. They don't take kindly to sitting outside.

 

[jbaker]

Dennis I have been waiting for your response,

and I am still waiting for a few more of you guys to chime in, Tom you don't count lol

I am getting good ideas from all this

 

[mhomrighausen]

Jeff B. Just get one of these and isntead of a Plow Day have a Hay Day Event.

Or CLICK HERE for some more input. Good reading on yesterday's Tractor about pulling a baler with different tractors.

 

[proessler]

Jeff, Farmall 300/350,IPTO, TA , Hyd.,Fast Hitch,an upgrade from Super H but similar size. New Holland baler & rake.

 

[jboelens]

We baled almost 200 bales yesterday, put my IH 560 in front of the baler this year. One thing to remember - when you deal with 50-75 year old equipment.. expect a few bumps in the road! LOL

 

[jbaker]

John,,are you heading my next?? lol

 

[bjamison]

Jeff B - don't know what your land layout looks like, but around my neck of the woods, small fields are the norm. With it came many Ford and Massey Ferguson tractors - smaller ones around 38-ish PTO hp. Models like the Ford 2, 3 and 4 thousand series tractors and the MF 35, 50 and 135 type tractors. The Perkins diesel is great, easy to work-on and very thrifty in the MF tractors. Out were you live, I get the impression that narrow front, row crop tractors were dominate - but here, it was the opposite.

Lots of 3 point roll-a-bar rakes are used around here too. Small fields and a 3 point rake make for an nice compact combo. Some of the PTO rakes are ground PTO driven and others are 540 PTO driven.

Sickle bars - rear mounted 3 point. Lots of Ford, MF and New Holland models were used. I would look for a belt driven mower vs something with a pitman arm.

Haybine - we are seeing a fair number of older haybines come on the market as disc mowers seem to be taking over. Haybines require very little hp vs a disc mower or discbine. Were I going to buy a haybine, I'd look for a New Holland 572. They've been around for a long time and are still in production today - so lots of parts and product knowledge about them.

Balers - Later New Holland balers, like the 273 vintage we see a lot around here. One of the BEST balers I ever worked behind was a John Deere 24T. That baler was reliable, tied knots flawlessly and where some of the New Holland balers made banana shaped bales, the Deere's bales were straight, clean bricks. We have seen MF, IH and Ford balers. Some like them - others hate them. I am told the Ford balers work GREAT if you get the feeder forks timed correctly.

Round balers - sooner or later, you might want to move to round bales. If just from nothing else, lack of manpower to make hay. I like the Hesston (Agco/MF) 530 type balers for small fields and would buy one or one of it's variants, i.e. CaseIH. Aside from being a small baler - the bale is small. Around here, lots of horse folks like that small round bale as it is easier to handle than larger round bales and squares are getting harder to find.

A sickle bar, haybine, square baler or round baler like I describe above do not demand crazy hp requirements and a Ford 3000 or a MF 135 can handle them. Live PTO generally comes with the Fords or MF tractors, but check before you buy - it's a very nice option to have.

As to making your own hay - I don't blame you for wanting to do it. It seems lots of folks making hay don't have a clue when to cut and bale to maximize the quality of the hay and if you have your own operation, you can make hay on your terms.

Lastly - go to your New Holland dealer and have them order you a copy of the New Holland Haymaker's Handbook. It's only about $15 and is a GREAT read.

Good luck!

 

[kmcconaughey]

I thought Jeff might like these photos I took at my mom's farm (aka the family farm) this past Sunday. One of my cousins owns the land to the North and to the East of my mom's farm and he plants crops on two of the fields on my mom's property. This year he has hay (Alfalfa?) in both fields. Sunday I was out putting up some trail cameras at the back of the farm and couldn't help but think of Jeff's thread on hay equipment and had to take photos of the recently cut hay. All three photos were taken from the same location but looking in different directions.

This first photo was taken looking Southeast.

The second photo was taken looking mostly South. The fence line with a few trees growing along it is the South property line.

This third photo was taken looking Northeast. The fence line in the background with the wood posts is the North property line. The fence separating the two fields has a row of Crab Apple trees growing along it. This photo was taken through a gap in the row of trees.