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Archive through July 22, 2005
- Thread starter lbuttke
- Start date
Help Support IH Cub Cadet Tractor Forum:
G
ggilbert
Guest
Hello...I have been reading a bit here, but this is my first post. I have an IH Cub 104 that will not start. I have a couple questions regarding the coil if someone out there could help me (please!).
I know the positive side of the coil goes to the ignition switch, but does the wire that goes to the points and the condenser wire go to the negative side or positive side?
I have juice at the pos. side of the coil, but no spark at all from the coil to the plug.
Thnaks for any help.
Greg
I know the positive side of the coil goes to the ignition switch, but does the wire that goes to the points and the condenser wire go to the negative side or positive side?
I have juice at the pos. side of the coil, but no spark at all from the coil to the plug.
Thnaks for any help.
Greg
rbedell
Well-known member
Greg:
Yes, the points and condenser go to the (-) negative side of coil. Here is a simplified ignition diagram for your reference:
You can check to make sure, that the body of the points and condenser have a good bond to ground. Also check to make sure, that your points, open and close, and there is good contact through the points. Point Gap should be .020".
Hope this helps,
(Message edited by rbedell on July 23, 2005)
Yes, the points and condenser go to the (-) negative side of coil. Here is a simplified ignition diagram for your reference:
You can check to make sure, that the body of the points and condenser have a good bond to ground. Also check to make sure, that your points, open and close, and there is good contact through the points. Point Gap should be .020".
Hope this helps,
(Message edited by rbedell on July 23, 2005)
Greg,
Along with Roland's suggestions, check to make sure the wires are making good contact with a bright, clean, oil-free connection.
Since at some time you're going to need to change the spark plug anyway, check to make sure it is good by using a new one. If there's no difference, you still have a new replacement plug you can keep or use in another Cub Cadet. If you don't have another one yet, don't worry. You will.
The spark plug wire and connections can also corrode, crack, and break down, so check to make sure it is good with an ohm meter, or by substituting one you know is good. Sorry I don't have the Kohler specs handy, but typically plug wires should have 10 - 15 K ohms per foot. If somebody has specs available, I'll welcome the exact figures in a correction. The connection inside the coil end can corrode, clean it with a wire "bottle brush" (preferable) or rolled up piece of sandpaper/emery cloth and blow it out. Do the same thing on the spark plug end of the plug wire to remove any corrosion there. Brush any corrosion from the exposed male connections of the plug and plug wire. Make sure each connection is tight.
The coil itself can break down from vibration, heat, or cantankerousness. Again, I don't have specs right now, but I believe they are listed in the Kohler manual, which you can download for free. The procedure should also be included for checking both the primary and secondary windings of the coil.
If you check each component and connection one step at a time, you'll be able to pinpoint the problem.
Along with Roland's suggestions, check to make sure the wires are making good contact with a bright, clean, oil-free connection.
Since at some time you're going to need to change the spark plug anyway, check to make sure it is good by using a new one. If there's no difference, you still have a new replacement plug you can keep or use in another Cub Cadet. If you don't have another one yet, don't worry. You will.
The spark plug wire and connections can also corrode, crack, and break down, so check to make sure it is good with an ohm meter, or by substituting one you know is good. Sorry I don't have the Kohler specs handy, but typically plug wires should have 10 - 15 K ohms per foot. If somebody has specs available, I'll welcome the exact figures in a correction. The connection inside the coil end can corrode, clean it with a wire "bottle brush" (preferable) or rolled up piece of sandpaper/emery cloth and blow it out. Do the same thing on the spark plug end of the plug wire to remove any corrosion there. Brush any corrosion from the exposed male connections of the plug and plug wire. Make sure each connection is tight.
The coil itself can break down from vibration, heat, or cantankerousness. Again, I don't have specs right now, but I believe they are listed in the Kohler manual, which you can download for free. The procedure should also be included for checking both the primary and secondary windings of the coil.
If you check each component and connection one step at a time, you'll be able to pinpoint the problem.
I made my little parts hunt last night. This is what I came home with.
Yes it is a ported hydro unit, complete 14 hp engine in pieces minus the crank, starter/generator, complete set of tires and wheels, rears are 23x10.50x12, carb, and air cleaner. And all for about 2/3 the going rate of a set of rear weights.
Yes it is a ported hydro unit, complete 14 hp engine in pieces minus the crank, starter/generator, complete set of tires and wheels, rears are 23x10.50x12, carb, and air cleaner. And all for about 2/3 the going rate of a set of rear weights.
G
ggilbert
Guest
Hmmmm...I replied, but I dont see the post. Anyway, thanks Rbedell and Bruce.
Question- If I have juice to the pos. side of the coil, but none coming out the negative side of the coil, is it safe to say that the coil is the culprit? I mean, the other componenets (voltage regulator, solenoid, etc.) are "upstream" of the coil- and with he thought of only two wires attached to the coil (to points and to condenser), thats basically the end of the connection, as everything terminates there.
I think bad coils are rare, but want to make sure it's quite possibly the coil before buying one, as you cannot return an electrical part.
Thanks again for the help!
Greg
Question- If I have juice to the pos. side of the coil, but none coming out the negative side of the coil, is it safe to say that the coil is the culprit? I mean, the other componenets (voltage regulator, solenoid, etc.) are "upstream" of the coil- and with he thought of only two wires attached to the coil (to points and to condenser), thats basically the end of the connection, as everything terminates there.
I think bad coils are rare, but want to make sure it's quite possibly the coil before buying one, as you cannot return an electrical part.
Thanks again for the help!
Greg
I want to install a hydralic lift on my cub cadet. From searching, it appears that I could install a car power steering pump off the flywheel and run that thru valving and then to a tie rod cylinder. How would that work?
From northerntool.com parts, this is what I found:
Prince Two-Way Detent Valve $89.99
Chief Heavy Duty Tie Rod Cylinder 2500 PSI, 2in. Bore, 6in. Stroke, 1 1/8in $49.99
How much stroke should I have?
From northerntool.com parts, this is what I found:
Prince Two-Way Detent Valve $89.99
Chief Heavy Duty Tie Rod Cylinder 2500 PSI, 2in. Bore, 6in. Stroke, 1 1/8in $49.99
How much stroke should I have?
G
ggilbert
Guest
Rbedell- No, unfortunately I do not have a meter. I was just outside messing with it again, and for some reason, I now have power to both the pos. and neg. sides of the coil, but still no spark. I talked to the guy I got the tractor from, and he is going to let me try a coil he has on hand. I learned that it has to be one with an internal resisitor.
In a strange way, it seems im makeing a little progress. I will keep ya posted.
Thanks,
Greg
In a strange way, it seems im makeing a little progress. I will keep ya posted.
Thanks,
Greg
Greg G.,
Take the wires off both (+) and (-) terminals and check resistance across the coil. Should be between 3 and 4 ohms. If values are out of this range, coil is bad. Your problem could be a bad condenser as well. This is harder to check unless you have a condenser tester. Easy just to replace and see if this restores spark.
Take the wires off both (+) and (-) terminals and check resistance across the coil. Should be between 3 and 4 ohms. If values are out of this range, coil is bad. Your problem could be a bad condenser as well. This is harder to check unless you have a condenser tester. Easy just to replace and see if this restores spark.
rbedell
Well-known member
Greg G:
As a suggestion, you could print off the diagram I previously posted, then take that and the coil to a Repair Shop, Auto Parts Store, TV or Electriconic Repair Shop, somewhere that has a VOM Meter and a person that knows how to use one, and have it checked. It would probably take less than a minute for someone who knows what they are doing.
As a suggestion, you could print off the diagram I previously posted, then take that and the coil to a Repair Shop, Auto Parts Store, TV or Electriconic Repair Shop, somewhere that has a VOM Meter and a person that knows how to use one, and have it checked. It would probably take less than a minute for someone who knows what they are doing.
G
ggilbert
Guest
UPDATE- Well, I got it running. I still cant explain the coil not having juice to the pos. or neg. side, but the wire that goes to the points was about cut in half. I replaced the wire, and it started right up.
The cover for the points is about a pain. I took my Dremel tool and cut out the bottom screw hole on the metal cover so I can slide the bottom hole over the screw rather than taking it all the way out. It has already came in handy.
Thanks for the help! It is greatly appreciated. Now I get to enjoy it!
Greg
The cover for the points is about a pain. I took my Dremel tool and cut out the bottom screw hole on the metal cover so I can slide the bottom hole over the screw rather than taking it all the way out. It has already came in handy.
Thanks for the help! It is greatly appreciated. Now I get to enjoy it!
Greg
mgonitzke
Well-known member
Got a question on a KT-17 series I. I got a parts tractor with one of these in it, and it was seized up. I have disassembled the engine except for splitting the case and removing the end cover, and am wondering what might cause one of the rods to seize to the crank. Oil pump maybe? Cylinders were in good condition. One odd thing I noticed was a couple grains of large quartz sand stuck in the oil ring of one of the pistons.
Thanks for any suggestions you may have.
Thanks for any suggestions you may have.
rbedell
Well-known member
Matt G:
This came up about 10 days ago and I will post again. Here is the Lubrication Diagram for the KT-17 Series I and Series II motors. On the Series I motor, the crank utilized the "splash" method while the Series II utilized a pressurized lubrication. Series I motor and most of their parts are NLA. I would NOT suggest that you try and rebuild this Series I. Lubrication failures was one of their downfalls.
I might suggest updating to a KT-17 Series II or a M-18 motor.
This came up about 10 days ago and I will post again. Here is the Lubrication Diagram for the KT-17 Series I and Series II motors. On the Series I motor, the crank utilized the "splash" method while the Series II utilized a pressurized lubrication. Series I motor and most of their parts are NLA. I would NOT suggest that you try and rebuild this Series I. Lubrication failures was one of their downfalls.
I might suggest updating to a KT-17 Series II or a M-18 motor.
mgonitzke
Well-known member
Roland B.-
I know this is a POS engine, but all I'm trying to do is get this thing running long enough to test the hydraulic lift in this 782 parts tractor before I install the parts in my 1810. (This is in the MTD Cub Cadet forum already.) I have another KT-17 series I that threw a rod, so between the two I think I can get one good engine, but I was just wondering if there would be something I should look hard for while I'm in there so I can fix it and make this thing run for more than five minutes so it can perform the previously mentioned task. After I make sure my hydro works I won't care what happens to this engine, it just needs to hold together long enough to test this.
I know this is a POS engine, but all I'm trying to do is get this thing running long enough to test the hydraulic lift in this 782 parts tractor before I install the parts in my 1810. (This is in the MTD Cub Cadet forum already.) I have another KT-17 series I that threw a rod, so between the two I think I can get one good engine, but I was just wondering if there would be something I should look hard for while I'm in there so I can fix it and make this thing run for more than five minutes so it can perform the previously mentioned task. After I make sure my hydro works I won't care what happens to this engine, it just needs to hold together long enough to test this.
