Look what i BoUgHt!!!!!!!!!

[mstetar]

just had to buy her! got a pretty good deal, i can get it to crank and sputter a little if i squirt fuel in the carb, but i really dont know anything about these old beasts, can some one point me in the direction of a group of great guys like on this site that know these farmalls? this is my first red one!

 

[digger]

Oh, your gonna have fun with that!

 

[dfrisk]

MATT - Not a bad looking Super A. Looks like it spent some time playing in the snow, there was maybe a frt blade for it somewhere, has chanins on the rear.

If it's sputtering then you have ignition. The carbs on those old IH's are really simple like the Carter carb's on a K-series Kohler. But it's probably made from cast iron. I like the fact somebody went to the effort of installing a 12V alternator in place of the 6V generator. Saves a LOT of electrical & battery problems down the road. The "Correct Police" don;t like them but try having one of their officers make a house call to help you get your Farmall started on a 20 Below Zero day with a foot of snow on the ground to move!

The guys here should be able to gve you good advice about what to check and do to get it running. Just like with CC's there's plenty of sources for good new & used parts for the Super A. http://www.redpowermagazine.com/forums/index.php

 

[wslombo]

Dennis - just to let you know that’s not a super A it’s a straight A with the wrong decals the reason is that it doesn’t have hydraulics its hand lift all super A had hydraulics

 

[dfrisk]

William - I guess I should have grabbed my copy of Guy Fay's Letter series originality guide before posting. I'll send my Correct Police Badge back to the home office too.

I'm guilty of putting "Super decals" on a couple Farmall's too. There was a '39 "SUPER H" around Erie & Hillsdale, IL back about 1974 with a white painted grill I may know something about. And the '51 M out in the shop wore Super M decals until it was repainted fall of '04 for the forth time. It's close to a Super M however, M&W 4" pistons, M&W live 2-way hyd, M&W Fast 4th gears, even has a Battery Box seat base I bought from FARMALL back in 1981 when they sold them as surplus for $5, I got two, the other one replaced the rusted out box on my Stg II Super H. The M also has Char-Lynn power steering, Nice old HORSE of an M. Even before it had the M&W's it would walk away from Dad's Super M-TA plowing with identicle IH #8 3-14's.

Maybe... some day.... I'd like to get a basket case A, not so much a B since they're rare, but make a REAL Super Garden Tractor like IH should have done with the 982. Used the A rearend for four speeds forward, stronger gears & shafts, more BEEF.

 

[gcoleman]

Excellent lookin little A, theyre one of my favorite tractors outside the CC's. One lives just down the road from me, and then two more down the road on the opposite direction. I wanted to buy one, but the guys wouldnt sell em to me. That'll make a fantastic little tractor as is or all shined up and refreshed.

 

[mgonitzke]

Dennis-

My dad's B will start just fine in the winter, and it's still got the 6V electrical system.

 

[aschumacher]

6 volt electrical system, didn't Model-T Ferds use that ! ?

 

[dfrisk]

ALLEN - I thought Model T's had a crank?

MATT - I'm NOT going into my 12V alternator verses 6V generator rant here. If 6V are so good, why didn't IH use 6V on CC's? Tiny little Kohler should start right up on 6V if a 113 or 123 CID 4-cylinder will right? O-K, now do a search and see how many THOUSANDS of posts are wanting to know why a CC won't start. And that's on 12V.

I will say neither the M or Super H were good starting tractors back in the 1960's when still 6V, both had block heaters and the SH still does to help them start. Granted my shop never gets below freezing except when it's below zero out but either tractor will fire right up now with no added heat or a block heater plugged in. They both are kinda cold blooded, have to be careful you don't let them sputter and die or they'll flood.

IH started using 12V back in the 40's on the MD, even LPG tractors in the early 50's got 12V and the gas tractors didn't. Think it was about '57 when ALL IH tractors went 12V, 350/450's.

You can't see the alternator on either of my tractors, there's no voltage regulator on either one, they both have good big Die Hard batteries, and the 6V starters spin the engines over twice as fast as any 6V ever would. If 6V generators were sooo good the last 5488 would have still had 6V.

 

[mstetar]

hey sorry it took me so long to respond, i thought it had the wrong decals when i first saw it but the S/N Tag is "F.A.A.60820" i thought that the double "A" indicated a super??

 

[mhomrighausen]

Good Morning, All. I'm not sure exactly what company offered a gear reduction starter for the FARMALL M and other tractors. My Dad installed one on our M for easier starting in the winter. I don't remember the serial number of the M. Both the 1946 FARMALL H and 1949 M were made into Super series in the early 1960s. Around 1962 or 1963 my parents bought a 1947 FARMALL B. My Dad kept good batteries in all the tractors and if I recall the B had a Sears Roebuck battery in it for as long as I can remember. The only time that any of the tractors were hard starting was when it got really cold. Plug in block heaters were added and even with them the below zero made starting in that weather hard. Otherwise I really don't recall my Dad much complaining about the tractors being hard starting. When we built the new dairy barn in 1967 the B with the grain o vator auger wagon was started and run twice a day to feed the dairy cows. All three tractors were six volt. The B would fire right up without hardly ever having to be cranked even the coldest of days. I won't try and start any six versus twelve volt starting system arguements here. From personal observations and recalling farmers visiting from time to time over when and why some farmers would convert their tractor from six volt to twelve volt it was because some farmers simply had troubles starting their tractors in the winter while others didn't. Even the mechanics at the local dealerships would later tell me the same thing when after my Dad passed away I would go into to see about service maintenance on our tractors. Also, from reading about ANY size tractor NOT wanting to start... every post that asks that question always get the same replies.... I.E. Do you have a loose wire? Did you check your ground? Is your switch bad? Do you have a bad cell in your battery?... etcetera, etcetera,etcetera... So from after reading and studying and absorbing all those posts concerning any size tractor not wanting go start and over all these years of doing so ... I have to agree with what women say... "Yes. Size does matter. Only it is how one uses it that truly does make the difference. Six volt versus twelve volt systems. If you don't have good contact with ground or other things then neither system is worth a darn." Then you could go into the arguement of as to why are some vehicles 24 volt?

Oh well... I'm going out to play with the tractors. Have a good day.

 

[wheinsohn]

I am not going to add much to the 6V verses 12V debate other than it depends on what the engine has for pistons. If they still have stock pistons or an IH rebuild kit, they will start easier. If they have the M & W or TSC Firecrator pistons in them, 6V will not be enough in cold weather. When my dad overhauled the M with firecrator pistons, the first thing we had to do that fall was put in a 12V battery. Because of the compression increase, it would barely turn over in the summer, let alone when it got cold. Even then when it got down to -25, it still had trouble starting with a fresh battery, cables and clean connections. After my dad passed away, I added a 2nd battery and it turns over like the middle of summer year round.

 

[dross]

Don't know if it was IH or not but I can remember dad talking about "High altitude" pistons. He claimed, done right, you could pull your old plow a gear faster.

 

[mhomrighausen]

The starter gear reduction was a must have when you installed the IH Firecrater or M&W pistons in your FARMALL M. That is why my Dad added it to the M. I don't believe it was available for an H although that I truly don't remember. I do recall seeing a lot of Ms that had been converted to 12 volt that did have the higher horsepower pistons/rings installed or were bored out and then had the Firecrater or M&W sets installed. In fairness though those same tractors didn't have that starter reduction kit installed on the tractor and therefore were truly hard to start even in the summertime. That reduction kit made the starter turn over slower only it gave more needed torque to the starter. If the tractor was kept tuned up on a regular basis that gear reduction was a lifesaver. If the tractor needed a tune up then nothing would help start it in the winter except a warm building and a plug in heater. As always sometimes a farmer would skimp "just a little" when tweaking things to get more horsepower. My folks even though money was tight realized that in order to get the most of the re-power they had to spend the $$$ for the starter gear reduction kit.

International Harvester offered what they called the Fire Crater pistons. If I recall correctly Perfect Circle made them for IH. Yes, once installed you could pull in optimum conditions a gear faster. This was GREAT... until no one factored in the tremendous amount of stress that you now were putting on the drivetrain by pulling the same implement at a faster speed. Usually the first thing to go were the bearings in the final drive and thus the cracked rear housings. Again... when re-powering the engine the rear end should have received a stronger bearing at least in the final drive. So... Therefore the proverbial trade off.

My thoughts on trying to start a Kohler 7,8,10,12, or even a 14 or 16 horse engine on six volts. It could definintely be done. You'd have to reconfigure the starter/generator and then add a gear reducer for the higher horsepower engines and like everything have a really good battery. However as I nowadays tell people. "Do I look that ambitious?"

A little more about six versus twelve volt systems. Isn't it funny how so many automotive companies had six volt systems in their products for several years? One must when visiting about such things consider several factors. Years ago batteries weren't as reliable as they are today. What in today's market is considered a mediocre battery years back would have been considered a fairly high quality battery even though a vehicle had trouble starting in the winter because of it. Advances in technology throughout the years now gives us very high quality batteries along with everything else.

Some aftermarket company made a piece for the front of the FARMALL M and H tractors that you added between the front pedestal and the steering column to make the steering somewhat easier. My Dad did that to the M and for some reason even though we had the piece we never got around to doing it to the H.

Have a wonderful day everyone!!!

 

[kmcconaughey]

The first 4 are from a 1963 Parts and Accessories Catalog. The last one is from a 1964 Parts and Accessories Catalog.

 

[mhomrighausen]

Kraig M. Thank you for posting those pictures. It's been many years since I've seen those. After reading about pulling a bigger implement, I think most farmers just pulled the present implement a gear faster. M&W pistons were a four ring piston and I heard from several mechanics and dealers they actually took away a little power from the top. On the plus side those M&W pistons tended to last longer than the other brands. Now... if you want a powerhouse for a tractor then install four inch FARMALL M pistons in an F20.

 

[lhinds]

There was probally a lot of starting problems due to wrong point settings, spark pluge and wire connections. I remember the 1950s Chrysler product cars had a starting problem in cold weather, or rainy weather. Also the jeeps were hard to start. We used to set the points with a dwell meter and then ground the distributor, and this would usually solve most of the starting problems. We had a distributorship for sinclair gasoline. Our delivery truck was a 50s international that you had to leave running while you unloaded it in the winter time. We finally ran a 8 volt battery in it and it helped a lot.So i asume a lot of little things contributed to starting problems. Just my 03c

 

[dfrisk]

O.M.G. Wish I could by a set of four pistons, sleeves, rings, etc for $44 or $71 now. I priced the complete overhaul from Carter & Gruenwald about 8-9 yrs ago, S&P, all gaskets, main, rod, & cam bearings, but didnt get into things like a new oil pump, water pump and the total was over $2000. S&P were over $300 per hole.

MARLIN - What you say about today's batteries is true, today's better batteries are better than ANYTHING available even 10 yrs ago let alone 30-40-50 etc. But the "Good Stuff" only gets in 12V batteries. Several years ago I heard the automotive industry was going to develop a 42V electrical system, haven't heard abything about that for a couple years. More volts equals less amps so smaller wires, etc.

LUTHER - Any gas delivery truck I ever saw, from the IH tank truck Dad's gas man delivered to farms with, to the 18-wheelers Dad drove after he quit farming, to our LP gas man's truck all had/have pumps that you had to leave the engine running to unload. There were only a few fuel terminals Dad delivered to that had elec. pumps so he didn't have to mess with his PTO from the tractor to the trailer. His old White RoadBoss only had 400,000 miles on it when it was retired but had another 100,000 miles of pumping on the engine.

The engine problems you mention even effect newer engines. One spring about '94 or '95 My '87 F150 w/300-6 would barely start and run those first few days in the spring when the frost came out of the ground after work. The plug wires had been replaced once but the spark was leaking out around the plug boots and distributor terminals so bad it would only start on 3-4 cylinders. Another new set of plug wires cured the problem. I will say that after 300,000 miles & 15 yrs I've never had a problem like that with my PSD. The new coil on plug & distributor-less engine designs make that problem a thing of the past.... so far.

 

[ewells]

Dennis cop ign did not eleminate problems.They can still carbon track in the boots and then have to replace coil.Also some of the cop systems use a plug with super long tip below plug threads and seat that can carbon up in the head and break off when trying to remove the plug.So technology just creates a new set of problems

 

[lhinds]

Edd i just the experienced the long tip spark plugs problem 3 weeks ago. One coil and plug + labor cost me 287.00. It kept blowing a fuse and would not start.Ford towed it but wouldn't pay for fixing it.
Dennis about 90% of gas we delivered dumped into underground tanks. I rebuilt the engine once in that old International. In 1987 that old truck was still being used on a farm.