-
This community needs YOUR help today. With the ever increasing fees of everything (server, software, domain, e-mail) , we need help. We need more Supporting Members, today. Please invest back into this community to help spread our love and knowledge of IH Cub Cadets. You get a lot of great new account perks including access to private forums. If you sign up for annual, I will ship a few IH Cub Cadet Forum decals too in addition to all the account perks you get. You can see what it looks like below.
Sign up here: https://www.ihcubcadet.com/account/upgrades
Archive through June 28, 2013
- Thread starter jbaker
- Start date
Help Support IH Cub Cadet Tractor Forum:
J
jclazar
Guest
That sure is a interesting sight glass. I would have opted for a hydro cover. Well, now officially a IH Cub Cadet.com site supporter! Got my subscription to Cadet Connection, and tossed in a fair order to CCSpecialties.org !
With fumble fingers, I dropped a really nice painted lift bar for the 3 point and messed up the paint work. bummer. Oh one day I'll get the 72 on all 4's, at least!
With fumble fingers, I dropped a really nice painted lift bar for the 3 point and messed up the paint work. bummer. Oh one day I'll get the 72 on all 4's, at least!
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2005
- Messages
- 1,259
- displayname
- Brian Branstetter
Great News! Finished tearing down the KT-17 and found there was no internal damage to the block other than a small pock mark in the side of the block.
The crank journal is fine other than a wad of aluminum built up on it, the clean areas measured stock so I should be able to get the aluminum cleaned off and have the crank check for straightness and what ever else they get checked for, I really don't know yet.
I plan on doing valve stem seals and lapping them in and I had considered new rings and a light honing if the measurements permit, not knowing for sure what has been done to it prior to our owning it. I can not wait to get things on order and get this thing together.
Here are a few pictures of the tear down.
Should I replace the governor gear
I thought the original was metal, so is this a replacement? Maybe this should be changed irregardless of condition? What are your thoughts. My thoughts are to replace it and my other surviving connecting rod just for the heck of it.
The crank journal is fine other than a wad of aluminum built up on it, the clean areas measured stock so I should be able to get the aluminum cleaned off and have the crank check for straightness and what ever else they get checked for, I really don't know yet.
I plan on doing valve stem seals and lapping them in and I had considered new rings and a light honing if the measurements permit, not knowing for sure what has been done to it prior to our owning it. I can not wait to get things on order and get this thing together.
Here are a few pictures of the tear down.
Should I replace the governor gear
Well, while we're on mowing decks I have a question. My 71, 72 and 73 all have 38 in. decks but have yet to mow with any of them. Is the 38 deck about right for these little dudes for just mowing your standard yard. No field mowing, tall wet grass or anything like that. Thanks
BILL J., STEVE B. - Yes, even the 38" decks plug the discharge chute in tall heavy grass when it's damp. They do a nice job of windrowing too. One of the modifications I did to my 38" deck was to widen the discharge chute similar to the 44&50" decks. Cut a pie shaped piece out of the lower surface of the deck that the spindles mount to, and cut along the bend on the back side of the discharge chute, bend the verticle piece left back and weld it to the back of the deck surface, then weld the pie-shaped piece into the top of the discharge. I also made a few other changes, like radiusing the left side of the deck so it trims closer to things, and welded new 2" high by 1/8" thk baffles about 1/8" away from the tips of the blades. It now throws grass about as well as my old 44 & 50" decks do.
I do think the 44" decks pull easier than a 38" deck, never ran a 42" deck, but I blame that on the step-up ratio in the deck pulleys to speed up the short outer blades so they cut.
The 70 came with a cast iron end deck and it got replaced with the later stamped deck like a 72/73 would have gotten. The CI end deck warped, and yes, the stamped end decks will too, but you can straighten them. You can't really do much with the big brittle cast iron sections that hold the spindles on the CI decks.
TERRY - Yes, a 7 HP CC should run a 38" deck O-K in normal conditions. The faster 2nd in the 72 & 73 will probably be too fast if your mowing more than an inch or so off the grass, but if well maintained they do a nice job. When I dropped the K241 in my 72 was when I could really start making the grass fly with my 38" deck in 2nd gear. About a year after I put the K241 in the 72 my Buddy asked me to come over and mow his back yard in the new house he bought. The house had set empty for a year, the grass was over 1-1/2 ft tall plus had the clippings from being mowed 2-3 times with a bush-hog mower on a small farm tractor the year before. The yard was about 10,000-12,000 square feet. Took me 2-3 hours to mow, I was taking 6-10 inch swaths because the discharge would plug if I took any more. Month later I made the modifications I described above. Now I at least can mow a full swath thru foot tall grass non-stop in 1st gear. Maybe if I put the old K181 back in the 72 I could mow in 3rd gear!
I do think the 44" decks pull easier than a 38" deck, never ran a 42" deck, but I blame that on the step-up ratio in the deck pulleys to speed up the short outer blades so they cut.
The 70 came with a cast iron end deck and it got replaced with the later stamped deck like a 72/73 would have gotten. The CI end deck warped, and yes, the stamped end decks will too, but you can straighten them. You can't really do much with the big brittle cast iron sections that hold the spindles on the CI decks.
TERRY - Yes, a 7 HP CC should run a 38" deck O-K in normal conditions. The faster 2nd in the 72 & 73 will probably be too fast if your mowing more than an inch or so off the grass, but if well maintained they do a nice job. When I dropped the K241 in my 72 was when I could really start making the grass fly with my 38" deck in 2nd gear. About a year after I put the K241 in the 72 my Buddy asked me to come over and mow his back yard in the new house he bought. The house had set empty for a year, the grass was over 1-1/2 ft tall plus had the clippings from being mowed 2-3 times with a bush-hog mower on a small farm tractor the year before. The yard was about 10,000-12,000 square feet. Took me 2-3 hours to mow, I was taking 6-10 inch swaths because the discharge would plug if I took any more. Month later I made the modifications I described above. Now I at least can mow a full swath thru foot tall grass non-stop in 1st gear. Maybe if I put the old K181 back in the 72 I could mow in 3rd gear!
Hey all - thanks for the deck feedback. I think two of mine are cast and one isn't but gonna have to look to be sure (they're in storage). I hope I have both types so I can actually compare them. Also have a 122 with no deck and sounds like the 44 would make a good setup. Thanks again.
jchamberlin
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2010
- Messages
- 1,842
- Location
- Farmville, North Carolina
- displayname
- Jeremiah Chamberlin
It's been a while since I've had the time to sit down and post some pictures, but since I snapped a few recently I thought I would share a little "Show and Tell." As Gerry Ide has pointed out, a lot of those who follow the forum are new to Cubbin' and may not realize what is involved in changing the fluid in their hydrostatic transmission. I remember the time I asked the local dealer where the drain plug was, so we all have to start somewhere!
Here I am, optimistically ready to begin my oil and filter change on my 149 S/N 2050047U464260 which I think was manufactured in 1974. I thought to myself, what is so complicated about popping off 7 bolts and changing a filter --right?
Well, to begin with, one bolt (on the bottom left in the picture) required the use of 3 foot cheater bar to break loose ??!!
Anyway, I got the oil flowing pretty quickly, I seem to remember getting out a dead blow hammer and striking the end plate on the end a few times
Note: I don't think this fluid is actually HyTran. The former owner was big on front end loaders and I suspect he used a generic hydraulic fluid. There are no gelatinous clumps of water-retaining fluid inside the housing as would be expected when filled with IH HyTran and left outside in the elements of coastal Carolina for ten years as this tractor was.
The new filter was not the same color as the old one, although it is difficult to tell in the view from the top:
It can be seen better from below (I think).
I finally managed to get the old filter off after breaking my favorite oil filter wrench and trying several tools and combinations to try to break it loose. Part of the problem was that ground interfered with my use of decent-sized levers (1/2" ratchet). I found the chain wrench to be the most effective tool, although it tended to get trapped behind the flex disk on the drive shaft above the filter.
Note that the close nipple came off with the filter instead of remaining on the transmission. I didn't discover this until I tried to attach the new filter. Although the Defense of Marriage Act has been knocked down by the Supreme Court, female oil filters still need male nipples to form an attachment for life.
A closer look at the tools I used to remove the oil filter:
The filter had already been deformed somehow before I started, so the end-cap style wouldn't work, the black strap wrench was too small to go around the existing filter, the rubber strap wrench was totally ineffective (as always), the "spider ratchet" (my favorite) broke before the filter let loose its grip on the transmission housing, and only the chain wrench made the grade. I think I picked it up at an auto parts store for less than $10.
The hardest part of the job turned out to be the removal of the old gasket.
My son, who is a Machinist Mate in the Navy (2nd Class), tells me that the gasket is made of a material known as Garlock, and it is famous for its sealing ability. I've encountered it before, and it always gives me fits. It seems that every last iota of the gasket has to be laboriously removed from the surface of BOTH the end plate and the housing. My old compressor is on the fritz, and I don't yet have the new one installed, or I would have gotten out the die grinder and the Scotch-Brite pads (which work wonderfully). As it was, I was reduced to scraping with every tool available. Whatever tool I start with, however, I always seem to wind up with a jack knife in my hand.
The new gasket and end plate prepared for installation:
I procured the gasket from a local IH dealer, but it seems strange to see "Fiat Group" printed on the packaging.
The tools I used to remove the gasket:
The fairly blunt "Gasket Removal Tool" was totally ineffectual in removing the Garlock gasket. The old plane blade wasn't sharp enough to get it all either, and even the knife struggled, but I think I got down to the metal on all the places that matter.
I put grease on both sides of the gasket before installing it and tightened all bolts to an arbitrarily chosen 25 ft-lbs. (My fingers were too dirty to access the manual, it rained the entire time I spent removing the gasket from the end plate, and it was threatening to rain again. I was running late for work (insert latest excuse here).
I purchased two gallons of HyTran from the dealer, and I tried to pour all but 1/2 a gallon into the transmission. But I lost a good bit fluid when it started pouring back out the drain hole after I removed the funnel and hose combination (not shown). So, if I were to do it over, I would pour in a gallon and start the tractor before topping off (which I have yet to do).
When I started the tractor and backed it into the shed, it seemed to have a lot more "pep" and shifted quite quickly into forward and reverse. I think that the new, genuine HyTran may have helped the performance of my tractor.
Here I am, optimistically ready to begin my oil and filter change on my 149 S/N 2050047U464260 which I think was manufactured in 1974. I thought to myself, what is so complicated about popping off 7 bolts and changing a filter --right?
Well, to begin with, one bolt (on the bottom left in the picture) required the use of 3 foot cheater bar to break loose ??!!
Anyway, I got the oil flowing pretty quickly, I seem to remember getting out a dead blow hammer and striking the end plate on the end a few times
Note: I don't think this fluid is actually HyTran. The former owner was big on front end loaders and I suspect he used a generic hydraulic fluid. There are no gelatinous clumps of water-retaining fluid inside the housing as would be expected when filled with IH HyTran and left outside in the elements of coastal Carolina for ten years as this tractor was.
The new filter was not the same color as the old one, although it is difficult to tell in the view from the top:
It can be seen better from below (I think).
I finally managed to get the old filter off after breaking my favorite oil filter wrench and trying several tools and combinations to try to break it loose. Part of the problem was that ground interfered with my use of decent-sized levers (1/2" ratchet). I found the chain wrench to be the most effective tool, although it tended to get trapped behind the flex disk on the drive shaft above the filter.
Note that the close nipple came off with the filter instead of remaining on the transmission. I didn't discover this until I tried to attach the new filter. Although the Defense of Marriage Act has been knocked down by the Supreme Court, female oil filters still need male nipples to form an attachment for life.
A closer look at the tools I used to remove the oil filter:
The filter had already been deformed somehow before I started, so the end-cap style wouldn't work, the black strap wrench was too small to go around the existing filter, the rubber strap wrench was totally ineffective (as always), the "spider ratchet" (my favorite) broke before the filter let loose its grip on the transmission housing, and only the chain wrench made the grade. I think I picked it up at an auto parts store for less than $10.
The hardest part of the job turned out to be the removal of the old gasket.
My son, who is a Machinist Mate in the Navy (2nd Class), tells me that the gasket is made of a material known as Garlock, and it is famous for its sealing ability. I've encountered it before, and it always gives me fits. It seems that every last iota of the gasket has to be laboriously removed from the surface of BOTH the end plate and the housing. My old compressor is on the fritz, and I don't yet have the new one installed, or I would have gotten out the die grinder and the Scotch-Brite pads (which work wonderfully). As it was, I was reduced to scraping with every tool available. Whatever tool I start with, however, I always seem to wind up with a jack knife in my hand.
The new gasket and end plate prepared for installation:
I procured the gasket from a local IH dealer, but it seems strange to see "Fiat Group" printed on the packaging.
The tools I used to remove the gasket:
The fairly blunt "Gasket Removal Tool" was totally ineffectual in removing the Garlock gasket. The old plane blade wasn't sharp enough to get it all either, and even the knife struggled, but I think I got down to the metal on all the places that matter.
I put grease on both sides of the gasket before installing it and tightened all bolts to an arbitrarily chosen 25 ft-lbs. (My fingers were too dirty to access the manual, it rained the entire time I spent removing the gasket from the end plate, and it was threatening to rain again. I was running late for work (insert latest excuse here).
I purchased two gallons of HyTran from the dealer, and I tried to pour all but 1/2 a gallon into the transmission. But I lost a good bit fluid when it started pouring back out the drain hole after I removed the funnel and hose combination (not shown). So, if I were to do it over, I would pour in a gallon and start the tractor before topping off (which I have yet to do).
When I started the tractor and backed it into the shed, it seemed to have a lot more "pep" and shifted quite quickly into forward and reverse. I think that the new, genuine HyTran may have helped the performance of my tractor.
jchamberlin
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2010
- Messages
- 1,842
- Location
- Farmville, North Carolina
- displayname
- Jeremiah Chamberlin
In my post below (which is at the size limit of the forum), I forgot to mention that I had to drop the mowing deck AND the carrier in order to properly access the filter. JPC
rchristensen
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 12, 2006
- Messages
- 933
- displayname
- Richard Christensen
Jeremiah Good write up on the hydro fluid change. One thing I might add for anyone who hasn't done one before is to lay a flat edge on the rear plate across the bolt holes. If some one has over tightened the bolts before in hopes of stoping leaks, the plate may have dimples where the bolt holes are. If so you need to pound them flat again so you will get a good gasket seal.
JEREMIAH - I don't understand why you used "grease" on the new gasket. I've got several types of Permatex, #1, #2, & Aviation form-a-gasket, every RTV known to man, plus my personal favorite, Hylomar Blue http://www.hylomar.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=62&Itemid=70. The only thing I use grease for is to cover the shafts that I slide new grease/oil seals over, like the bar axles on my Super H. The sealing surface for the outer axle seals on H's & Super H's is the same 2-1/2" dia. as the axle with two 1/2" wide keyways. Have to protect the seal from that rough axle surface & keyway. I use Hylomar on the OD of grease seals, helps them slide in easier and seals any small imperfection that may cause a leak later.
- Joined
- Dec 3, 2005
- Messages
- 812
- displayname
- Binder 1650
Quick question: This carb is on 1650 (14hp engine from another QL tractor). What make is it and how do I know what size it is? For some reason I'm thinking it's a Walboro - but there is no writing on it, except for some numbers on the side - which are hardly readable. I'm also thinking Walboro carbs were used on the QL's vs Carter?
Here are some pics. I'd like to get a carb kit, but need to know what I've got first. Any help would be appreciated.
Here are some pics. I'd like to get a carb kit, but need to know what I've got first. Any help would be appreciated.
Bill J,
You have two adjustment needles (High and idle) on that carb which makes it a Carter. K321's used a 30 size carb same as K341's. Walbro carbs didn't start being used until after IH sold the CC line to MTD and Series II KT-17's were used in production
You have two adjustment needles (High and idle) on that carb which makes it a Carter. K321's used a 30 size carb same as K341's. Walbro carbs didn't start being used until after IH sold the CC line to MTD and Series II KT-17's were used in production
Bill J.
You showed pics of everywhere except where you need to look.
Look under the choke butterfly do-hickie up at the top, inside the carb.
You showed pics of everywhere except where you need to look.
Look under the choke butterfly do-hickie up at the top, inside the carb.
Let's see if Kraig's awake.
