D
dvogt
Guest
for anyone who does alot of transaxle work I came up with this little adaptor so I can put them on a engine stand. makes it alot easier
-
This community needs YOUR help today. With the ever increasing fees of everything (server, software, domain, e-mail) , we need help. We need more Supporting Members, today. Please invest back into this community to help spread our love and knowledge of IH Cub Cadets. You get a lot of great new account perks including access to private forums. If you sign up for annual, I will ship a few IH Cub Cadet Forum decals too in addition to all the account perks you get. You can see what it looks like below.
Sign up here: https://www.ihcubcadet.com/account/upgrades
Help Support IH Cub Cadet Tractor Forum:
Finally had the opportunity to degree a K361 camshaft. Below are listed the specifications as assembled in a K301 block with stock Kohler lifters. The timings are listed seat-to-seat with lash set to factory specs:
Kohler K-361 Camshaft Specifications
Exhaust Opens – 50 deg BBDC
Exhaust Closes – 25 deg ATDC
Inlet Opens – 52 deg BTDC
Intake closes – 79 deg ABDC
Overlap – 77 deg
Exhaust Duration – 255 deg
Inlet Duration – 311 deg
Max Lift Exhaust - .306 in
Max Lift Intake - .325 in
Note – Clearances set at:
Exhaust - .017
Inlet - .008
Kohler K-361 Camshaft Specifications
Exhaust Opens – 50 deg BBDC
Exhaust Closes – 25 deg ATDC
Inlet Opens – 52 deg BTDC
Intake closes – 79 deg ABDC
Overlap – 77 deg
Exhaust Duration – 255 deg
Inlet Duration – 311 deg
Max Lift Exhaust - .306 in
Max Lift Intake - .325 in
Note – Clearances set at:
Exhaust - .017
Inlet - .008
I'm back to assembling the engine for my plowing tractor. At this stage I have a choice in cams; K361 or a regrind/aftermarket. The engine in question is a 14hp, sporting a longer aftermarket rod. The valves are the later style with the larger exhaust. I plan on running with an open pipe and a reworked carburetor, high RPM will be 4000.
When I set out to build this engine 2 years ago, the thing to use would be a K361 cam, is this still the case, or is there another cam I could better utilize?
When I set out to build this engine 2 years ago, the thing to use would be a K361 cam, is this still the case, or is there another cam I could better utilize?
D
dvogt
Guest
the K361 cam is still a good overall cam. Seymore small engines & Vogels grind some stocker cams with a advance ground into them which makes it a little easier since you don't have to find a way to advance it yourself
D
dvogt
Guest
I don't know, We've never made that comparison on the same motor. a 7deg advance is what we typically used.
Here is a comparison of valve timings and lifts for three different camshafts as degreed in a K301 engine. These are all seat-to-seat timings with lash clearances set to either the engine manufacturer’s or cam maker’s specification. The “Cheater” cam is that purchased from Madson’s Service, Inc., and is the camshaft I’m running in my K301.
It is somewhat helpful to have a timing / lift comparison chart based on a stock camshaft. It should be kept in mind, however, that a spec chart only tells part of the story. The lift rates, or acceleration, of the valve opening and closing events are equally as important for good engine performance. These are not usually quoted in cam maker’s info, as this is the art and science of making a high performance camshaft that must yield high time-area values (for improved breathing) without sacrificing durability of the valve train components.
Nowadays most valve timing events are based on a .050 valve opening as being the angular crankshaft position for opening or closing of the valve. This is due to the high degree of variation in lash ramp timings cam makers incorporate in their designs. The thought is that once the valve was open .050, the lifter was off of the lash ramp and onto the lift ramp of the cam, thus more beneficial comparative information would be obtained. The Kohler camshafts have a lash ramp of around 40 degrees (crank rotation) so they are very similar; hence lifts are given here as seat-to-seat. The Cheater cam has somewhat shorter and steeper lash ramps (about 25 degrees) somewhat typical for a performance camshaft. It also has higher valve acceleration rates as well, but not so high as to cause valve float using the stock springs and lifters.
Again, use this chart for camshaft comparison purposes only. It does not predict, performance-wise, how they will compare in a running engine. Only a dyno test will reveal this.
It is somewhat helpful to have a timing / lift comparison chart based on a stock camshaft. It should be kept in mind, however, that a spec chart only tells part of the story. The lift rates, or acceleration, of the valve opening and closing events are equally as important for good engine performance. These are not usually quoted in cam maker’s info, as this is the art and science of making a high performance camshaft that must yield high time-area values (for improved breathing) without sacrificing durability of the valve train components.
Nowadays most valve timing events are based on a .050 valve opening as being the angular crankshaft position for opening or closing of the valve. This is due to the high degree of variation in lash ramp timings cam makers incorporate in their designs. The thought is that once the valve was open .050, the lifter was off of the lash ramp and onto the lift ramp of the cam, thus more beneficial comparative information would be obtained. The Kohler camshafts have a lash ramp of around 40 degrees (crank rotation) so they are very similar; hence lifts are given here as seat-to-seat. The Cheater cam has somewhat shorter and steeper lash ramps (about 25 degrees) somewhat typical for a performance camshaft. It also has higher valve acceleration rates as well, but not so high as to cause valve float using the stock springs and lifters.
Again, use this chart for camshaft comparison purposes only. It does not predict, performance-wise, how they will compare in a running engine. Only a dyno test will reveal this.
Just realized there is an error in my chart. Exhaust Opens, Deg BTDC should read Deg BBDC.
Thanks for the answers guys, I'm attempting to have time to resume building the engine I had set out to build a couple years ago. Thanks to some good Federal Mogul assembly lube on critical wear surfaces, there's been NO corrosion at all and is ready to resume assembly.
About the only thing that's used/refurbed/rebuilt on this is the carb, block, crank, flywheel, and some tin. Other than those parts, it's ALL new parts.
About the only thing that's used/refurbed/rebuilt on this is the carb, block, crank, flywheel, and some tin. Other than those parts, it's ALL new parts.
Does anyone know for sure what engine the large base lifters that are being sold through several venders originally came out of? I've asked several people and there doesn't seem to be any common consensus. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
D
dvogt
Guest
if I remember right itt was a 6 cyl. continental industrial engine.
Well-
I'm going to answer my question about the valve springs. Tonight I put in the "non rotator" type springs, this will make for lower spring pressure than stock, and running the K361 cam. <anyone having experience, or bad experiences, speak up now!!>
I'm going to answer my question about the valve springs. Tonight I put in the "non rotator" type springs, this will make for lower spring pressure than stock, and running the K361 cam. <anyone having experience, or bad experiences, speak up now!!>
Wyatt, AT 4OOO RPM's, it'll be fine. That's only 400 more than stock rated RPM's, and the lift on the k361 cam is the same. It will actually take a little less effort for the cam to open the valves, which in pulling terms on a lawn stock class engine means more power to the ground. I got a valve spring testing scale a couple years ago and you'd be amazed what you can learn from valve springs.
Rick
Rick
Was just wondering why the twin magnum series isn't used for pulling. I was just given one and thought I would make use of it. Was this one of Kohlers oops not strong enough for hard use engines. The guy that gave it to me said he always had trouble with head gaskets. Any thoughs? Oh, it a 18hp. Thanks.
I went to the local garden tractor pull today. They had what they call a Home Town class for anyone that wanted to bring thier lawnmowers in and hook to the sled. I took my 1650 and 149. The track was dried, hard clay. At first they weren't going to let me pull because I had ag tires on but since I was the only one in the class that showed up for the driver's meeting, the voted to let me pull. They were both weighted about the same except the 1650 at calcium in the 10.50 Good Years with 85# of weights in each wheel and the 149 just had windshield washer fluid in the 10.50 Titan Tru-power ATs with 90# of weights in each wheel. The 1650 spun out at 130' and the 149 spun out at 116'. There was also a JD 112 with a 400# driver and turf tires but he started slipping his drive belt at 96'. Here is a couple pictures of the 1650 and 149 that my wife took.
D
dvogt
Guest
Kieth. no one makes any parts for the opposed twins. they were never very reliable in stock form so I think that kept a fair number of people away from them. then the V twins came & kinda obsoleted the oposed.
Wes , thats why I always say "Belts are alright for holdin up yer pants"
Wes , thats why I always say "Belts are alright for holdin up yer pants"
D
dvogt
Guest
hard to take a rearend seriously when its pink
