Archive through May 25, 2007

[snorris]

Anybody know if the 'super steering' upgraded front end and the dodge dart rear axle/diff assembly will work properly in the original cadet ?

Thanks

 

[gfedwards]

Stevenson,
I am not sure about the steering upgrade but the Dart kit will not work because of the way the braking system is implemented into the Original's left rear axle. Also, the axle housings are really thin and inadequate and will not allow the larger bores for the larger axles, bearings and seals.

 

[mgonitzke]

Super steer axle probably won't work, as originals have the drag link going to the right spindle instead of the left like all the other ones. Not to mention it probably won't physically fit anyway.

 

[tdrudis]

Ok so I got bored and decided to see what a 16hp v-twin looked like in my 70. After taking apart the front end and some rough measuring I reallized the briggs shaft is about 1/2 inch higher than stock. I was thinking the easiest way to solve this would be to angle the driveshaft up and tip the motor back. I would then need a u joint at the rearend to accomidate the angle. Any of you guys have any info or pics on this type of engine swap? If Charlie is watching I did try and look in the vault etc.

 

[digger]

Tim D.
I'm always watchin!hehehe
You dint look quite good enough,

 

[tdrudis]

Charlie I'm guessing there are two joints and the clutch has been relocated. Food for thought, Thanks. I had this feeling you would be the first to answer. By the way this is my parts tractor I ain't cutting up my good one. I just need more power for the snowblower.

 

[snorris]

I just found a fella locally that has three cadets sitting in his yard. He gave me one, and said he might be willing to work out a deal for the other two.

He gave me a 102, and the others are a 125 and 149.
Which of the three would be best for building into a mild puller? The 125 and 149 are hydro's, which I know almost nothing about. Engines are 10, 12, and 14hp on them.

Thanks for any advice.

 

[gcoleman]

Stevenson, the gear drives cubz are much better for pulling, in my opinion, because it is direct drive, whereas hydro's turn mechanical energy into heat energy, and you loose about 2 hp to the wheels, so a 149 has 14 hp stock, and the wheels only transfer 12 to the ground, not the case in a gear drive.You have a 1o hp kohler in your 102, and you will get 10 hp to the ground, good luck, and JMHO, Glen

 

[dmull]

...those front grills on the 125 make them have 2 less hp..and it's a narrow frame hydro on top of that!

Gear jammers all the way!!

 

[mgonitzke]

Glen C.-

A couple of the statements you made are a bit misleading. First, hydrostatic transmissions do not turn mechanical energy <u>entirely</u> into heat, the way you said that makes it seem as if ALL the energy has been turned into heat. Mechanical to fluid back to mechanical again, with some heat created in the process. Second, not all hydros lose 2 h.p., that number is different depending on the horsepower rating of the engine in the tractor. Someone posted on the main forum once that the hydros in these cubs are 80% efficient, so that makes 2.8 h.p. lost in a 14 h.p. hydro. Also a gear drive transmission isn't 100% efficient, it's more like 95% or so, with slight amounts of energy being lost to friction, noise, and heat. Nothing is 100% efficient. But you are correct that the gear drives are the preferred tractors.

Stevenson-

My advice would be to use the 102 as a puller, and try to get the 149 from him to fix up for use as a mower and for general yard work.

 

[snorris]

Thanks for the advice guys, I really appreciate it !

The 102 has a broken connecting rod I figure, as the engine spins freely. It seems to only be missing a few parts overall. Rust on it is about as bad as my original, but I know thats actually a minor problem. The owner of the 125 and 149 is on a boating trip, so I have to wait at least a week to talk to him again...

It looks like the lights from the 125 will fit the 102, is that right ? Are there any other parts interchangeable between them you can think of ? He already told me he views the 125 as a parts mower for the 149, but I don't see much that looks like it would fit the 149. The 149 has a bad PTO clutch. I read on here about rebuilding that and it seems simple enough. If we don't work out a deal for the 125 and 149, maybe he will let me buy parts off the 125...

Thanks as always.

 

[mgonitzke]

Stevenson-

Don't suspect a broken rod before pulling off the head... a stuck valve will also make it seem to turn freely. 125 lights will not fit the 102. PTO clutch, engine, wheels, front axle, fenders, etc. are interchangeable between the 102 and 125. Transmission final drive (not pump), hydro lever, motor, and wheels from the 125 would work on the 149. PTO clutches are pretty simple to rebuild.

 

[kmcconaughey]

Stevenson, Matt, could also be a failed piston.

 

[snorris]

Wow !

I never saw a piston blow its top before ! I didn't even know they could break like that.

 

[dvogt]

Thats a pretty common failure on the 14 & 16 engines. seam to let go around the piston ring. must be thin there.

Stevenson: I have put a dart kit in an Original rearend before. pretty easy. all you need to do is bore your brake hub out & key the left axle for it. the bad thing about the original is possible brake drag. it can kep you from going straight

Tim D. : what alot of guys do is tip the ront of the rearend up. tip the back of the engine down. then you can keep a nice straight drive line.

 

[dfrisk]

DON - What's the best way to prevent that type of piston failure Kraig had? I saw that engine at Dave's place in about the condition Kraig's picture shows. At least Detroit Diesel machined holes so You could bolt THEIR pistons back together!

I've heard of piston skirts cracking off but that failure was a rather new on for Me on a stock engine.

 

[dvogt]

I haven't seen that failure with the mahle style pistons yet

 

[jcarlton]

Hey Don I have a quick question, anyone else feel free if you have the experience, my uncle and myself are building a couple stock class tractors for a small poor boys club here in Southern Illinois and the guy with the sled told us that a K241 even bored to a k301 bore will never hang with the twelves....My dad and uncle used to beat K321's, 301's when they pulled stock class, what's his edge? He also claims to turn 30+ horses with a port and polish some valve work, 18hp cam and LP head running race gas, from what he told us they allow pretty much anything engine wise as long as it has a k301 on the ID tag and stock valves(but you can grind the to whatever....outside of that he looks for a kill switch and wheelie bars sounds a lil squirly to me...course he also claims he and his friend are 1 and 2 in the nation in the 12 hp stock class and they hung with NQS 30 cubes @Duquoin he says....

 

[bbrigham]

I could be wrong but, 30hp from a 301?

.Now if he's hiding N2O or a supercharger mabey.

 

[dvogt]

well 30hp is doable out of a 301 but not at gov. rpms. There is no Nationwide 12 hp stock class so thats a bit big. I was in Dequin, there were a few 30's there that were very low on power. if a 10 & a 12 are both stock the 12 would have the edge. now there is always gearing. if you get on a track that the 10 has better gearing it can beat a 12. also a fresh 10 would be stronger than a worn out 12. there really is no replacement for cubic inch's.