Jeremy, That would be the way electricity works, it has to do with resistance. The starter generator will turn freely with little amp draw. When amp draw increases the resistance (bad connection, fraid wire, rust) increases. When resistance overcomes the load stuff stops. Worse case senerio you let the magic smoke out of the wire.
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Archive through March 11, 2012
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hydroharry
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- Harry Bursell
Jeremy - one other thing I should have mentioned but you probably won't want to hear. The xx6/xx7 series was prone to problems with the wiring harness. The original harness had a cloth covering on the wire, and I don't know if it was the cloth or the wire itself, but for some reason the wires seem to corrode and disintegrate. If you have this problem you might want to just jump direct to your S/G from your truck to get your engine started and do what ever is necessary to get it running good, and then decide what you might want to do about the overall wiring harness. I've seen some real hack jobs, splices, jumpers, etc., out there that work but don't look pretty. Many of the connections or wires themselves on the original harness will break if they just sense you are going to touch them. There are some sources to get reasonably priced replacement harnesses so you won't have a wiring problem again (or at least a few decades) BUT before you go that route I'd recommend you make sure your engine issues are resolved and it runs good.
Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (but sometimes develop wiring issues)
Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (but sometimes develop wiring issues)
I recently purchased a Bosch coil from one of the forum's sponsors. No problem there, but as I was getting prepared to install it I was recently asked if the coil was internal resistance. I'm at a loss. I don't know if it is and I don't know what other types of coils there are. There is nothing written on the coil. Beginning at coils 101 would someone please tell me where I can find out what is important here for me to know.
Gary S.
If you bought it from Dave Kirk, you musta missed this part.
"can be used as an exact replacement coil using stock condenser and breaker points. No additional ballast resistor required."
If you bought it from Dave Kirk, you musta missed this part.
"can be used as an exact replacement coil using stock condenser and breaker points. No additional ballast resistor required."
jchamberlin
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- Jeremiah Chamberlin
Gary: Not to worry --Like Charlie said, the coil has an internal resistor. If anyone has an issue about it, compare ohm meter readings to a coil that is known NOT to have an external "ballast" resistor.
As a side note, the issue is current draw. The Bosch coil and many others, have a resistor in-line on the primary side. The resistor's function is to "throttle" the current so that when the points close, the path from the battery (through the ignition switch) is not a dead short, but slows the current up enough that there is at least a 6 volt "drop" across the coil.
Why is this? The power-mad among us will reason that if you take the resistor out of the circuit, you will get a hotter spark. They are correct. The problem is, if the engine is ever stopped with the ignition key on, then the battery is quickly drained, and the coil is often over-heated to the point of failure. Running the engine at high rpms is viewed by the coil as an almost "always on" condition, wide open throttle stresses it as well.
Given these facts, who would ever make and install a coil WITHOUT a "ballast" resistor?
Chevrolet.
General Motors Corporation, in its infinite wisdom, designed a coil ignition system in which when the key was put to the "start" position, the ballast resistor was by-passed (yielding a hotter spark); and when the key was in the "ign" position, the ballast resistor was in the circuit, yielding a running spark adequate to run the engine (even at high rpms when the points were almost always closed) without either stressing the coil or draining the battery (actually drawing too much current from the alternator [or generator]).
The "accessory" position was created to pass power from the battery to devices OTHER THAN the ignition coil, because the coil draws so much juice when the points are closed. I don't think it is much of an issue anymore with today's electronic ignition systems complete with all the interlocks available in computer logic and/or auxiliary circuits.
Edit: I discovered this when my '73 Pontiac would start fine, but die as soon as I let off the starter: Talk about a head scrather!
As a side note, the issue is current draw. The Bosch coil and many others, have a resistor in-line on the primary side. The resistor's function is to "throttle" the current so that when the points close, the path from the battery (through the ignition switch) is not a dead short, but slows the current up enough that there is at least a 6 volt "drop" across the coil.
Why is this? The power-mad among us will reason that if you take the resistor out of the circuit, you will get a hotter spark. They are correct. The problem is, if the engine is ever stopped with the ignition key on, then the battery is quickly drained, and the coil is often over-heated to the point of failure. Running the engine at high rpms is viewed by the coil as an almost "always on" condition, wide open throttle stresses it as well.
Given these facts, who would ever make and install a coil WITHOUT a "ballast" resistor?
Chevrolet.
General Motors Corporation, in its infinite wisdom, designed a coil ignition system in which when the key was put to the "start" position, the ballast resistor was by-passed (yielding a hotter spark); and when the key was in the "ign" position, the ballast resistor was in the circuit, yielding a running spark adequate to run the engine (even at high rpms when the points were almost always closed) without either stressing the coil or draining the battery (actually drawing too much current from the alternator [or generator]).
The "accessory" position was created to pass power from the battery to devices OTHER THAN the ignition coil, because the coil draws so much juice when the points are closed. I don't think it is much of an issue anymore with today's electronic ignition systems complete with all the interlocks available in computer logic and/or auxiliary circuits.
Edit: I discovered this when my '73 Pontiac would start fine, but die as soon as I let off the starter: Talk about a head scrather!
Jeremiah
You both are correct. But as a chevy guy that always made perfect sense to me, grew up on it.
Dodge also used a ballast resistor early 70'S.
Now I do have to say as much as I was never a ford guy they did have that right.
IMHO
Bill
You both are correct. But as a chevy guy that always made perfect sense to me, grew up on it.
Dodge also used a ballast resistor early 70'S.
Now I do have to say as much as I was never a ford guy they did have that right.
IMHO
Bill
Should add Dad was a mechanic for 20 some years at a Chevy dealer in Breckenridge Mi.
I worked with him for 10 years, got to know them in side and out.
He and I now get to learn together on Cub Cadets, not to the in side out yet.
Bill
I worked with him for 10 years, got to know them in side and out.
He and I now get to learn together on Cub Cadets, not to the in side out yet.
Bill
mgallinaro
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- MICHAEL J. GALLINARO
Norm,
Mine is a gravity feed with a shut-off valve.
Mine is a gravity feed with a shut-off valve.
hydroharry
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- Harry Bursell
Norm - all the Quiet Line tractors with Kohler engines, are gravity feed on fuel to the engine. In fact, if your engine sputters and stops, and you still see a little fuel in the bottom of the tank, it's because the gas line from the tank to the carb usually makes just a slight arch above the bottom level of the tank, so the last few drops of gas don't run into the carb. Since there is no filter on the line you don't get any crud from the bottom of the tank.
Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (but some may not run with low fuel in their tanks)
Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (but some may not run with low fuel in their tanks)
Okay, got a question. I'm assembling my K321 and the CC manual says make rear seal flush. Kohler manual says inset 1/8". Neither looks good to me, I set it so the seal lip has good contact with the crankshaft, inset about 3/16" to 1/4" (see pic). How critical is this? I don't want to have to disassemble this engine later.
I helped my neighbor with his flooded basement this am and picked up a few bolts to bolt my 12 K back into the 125 frame. I will have to back the bolts out to get the wiring harness back in place.
This is why I say two steps forward one back lol.
I have an odd question. I have 2 different styles of keys. An oval head and a round head. I can remember a few old farmalls I have been around having the oval head. is the round head a replacement or a built after this date thing? I just wondered. thanks.
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Harry - with regard to the QL tractors and their gravity feed fuel supply and no fuel filter, would adding one impede fuel flow such that the engine wouldn't run as it otherwise should?
Thanks!
Bill
Thanks!
Bill
hydroharry
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Don T - way up north - what you describe falls under the category of doing it the right way, or re-doing it the way the factory did it (assuming the factory way is considered correct). There are some people out there that would take a file or angle grinder and just grind off that little tip of the frame so the harness fits along the frame channel. Some people may disconnect the wires on the harness and loop it back into the frame channel and then pull it up thru the slotted area where the factory had originally run the harness (which may also work for you). Some people may try to flatten the harness and squeeze it thru that little space where the frame gets close to the engine shroud. But you're right, going back and loosening the 4 engine mount bolts, or maybe even having to remove them completely so you can move the engine enough to get the harness back into the correct position, is the best method to do this. Most of us have been there, done that, got the T-shirt, wore the T-shirt out and did it again - glad to see you joined so many of us.
Bill J (under edit) - I've seen fuel filters added to QL tractors and I wondered myself if they may impede the flow of the fuel. But since the tractors seem to run ok, I think the only thing that may happen is that they may stop running (seem to run out of gas) when there is a little more fuel in the tank than without the filter. In effect, the filter impedes the flow slightly and only when the level in the tank gets very low. By the way, I believe the fuel tank may have a screen at the bottom, or the shut off valve that Michael mentions, has a screen built into it. Probably not as good as a filter but you hardly ever hear of someone having a carb contamination problem. I've seen some crud on the bottom of the carb bowl but don't recall ever really having an issue I thought was a result of dirty fuel.
Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (and always require a few tricks of the trade)
Bill J (under edit) - I've seen fuel filters added to QL tractors and I wondered myself if they may impede the flow of the fuel. But since the tractors seem to run ok, I think the only thing that may happen is that they may stop running (seem to run out of gas) when there is a little more fuel in the tank than without the filter. In effect, the filter impedes the flow slightly and only when the level in the tank gets very low. By the way, I believe the fuel tank may have a screen at the bottom, or the shut off valve that Michael mentions, has a screen built into it. Probably not as good as a filter but you hardly ever hear of someone having a carb contamination problem. I've seen some crud on the bottom of the carb bowl but don't recall ever really having an issue I thought was a result of dirty fuel.
Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (and always require a few tricks of the trade)
dwilkinson
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- Doug Wilkinson
I added an in line fuel filter to my 128 and found that it ran out of gas with some still in tank. Learned that that filter was designed for an engine that uses a fuel pump verses the gravity set up on my tractor. Changing to a gravity type filter and everything is good.
