E-85

[kweaver]

Exxon shatters profit records
Oil giant makes corporate history by booking $11.7 billion in quarterly profit; earns $1,300 a second in 2007.

Henri - I wouldn't own a car that I could pick up off the ground with my hands.

 

[kide]

KentucK
So I guess you won't be in the market for one of those new Mercedes Smarts????

Hope your better half is better....

 

[hcole]

Kentucky, if you can pick up my car with your hands then you're a right smart stonger'n me

.'Course I know you can't 'cause you've got a bad back

 

[kweaver]

Henri - What ya think started my back on it's final down hill slide ? Ask the ol lady and the youg guy @ Sears Auto Sales on Hwy 25S in Corbin. I did it 2 summers ago.

 

[bwatson]

Terry, common sense says the folks claiming 40% mileage loss either made mistakes or intentionally skewed the results. A couple years ago the farm broadcasters from WHO radio in Des Moines did an E-85 comparison with 2 Chevy SUV's. They ran both of them out of fuel, then filled one with 10% ethanol blend and the other with E-85. They drove them both around the race track at the Ia State Fairgrounds with the cruise on till they ran out of fuel again. The 10% gas fuel truck went farther, but the lower price of E-85 made it more economical. They came up with about 2mpg difference. Thats right in line with GM's claim.
I'm going to guess the reason for not going straight alcohol is probably cold weather starting, and to keep idiots from getting drunk on it. The second reason I'm guessing comes from a case where an employee of an ethanol plant drank some while on the job and got fall down drunk from what was reported. The guy got fired and couldn't understand why unemployment benefits were denied... Stupid is as stupid as does.
Kentuck, E-85 is 85% alcohol 15% gasoline. E-85 has its own, unique odor. Kind of a hint of gas with that rotten egg like smell that comes from a catalytic converter thats been fuel fouled.

 

[kweaver]

Brian - I knew it ... just waiting for someone to say it so I could post this from MTD's website (got molded waiting so long)

 

[tcbusch]

Not only is E85 inefficient, it is also apparently destroying the environment as well.

"Clearing land to produce biofuels such as ethanol will do more to exacerbate global warming than using gasoline or other fossil fuels, two scientific studies show."

"One study -- written by a group of researchers from Princeton University, Woods Hole Research Center and Iowa State University along with an agriculture consultant -- concluded that over 30 years, use of traditional corn-based ethanol would produce twice as much greenhouse gas emissions as regular gasoline. Another analysis, written by a Nature Conservancy scientist along with University of Minnesota researchers, found that converting rainforests, peatlands, savannas or grasslands in Southeast Asia and Latin America to produce biofuels will increase global warming pollution for decades, if not centuries"

Click here for the full article http://tinyurl.com/34kcme

"Ethanol supporters argue, correctly, that ethanol releases fewer greenhouse gasses (about 12 percent, compared to gasoline) when it's burned in a car engine."

"However, they always ignore or dismiss the harm done to the environment when ethanol is produced. Ethanol plants are powered by fossil fuels. It takes so much water and fertilizer and energy to grow and harvest corn; more than four gallons of water for one gallon of ethanol, and enough fertilizer to create a dead zone the size of New Jersey in the Gulf of Mexico."

"Add that to the fact that a full tank of E-85 (85 percent ethanol) will take you only as far as three-fourths of a tank of gasoline - you have to burn more ethanol to drive the same distance - and it's tremendously difficult to make the argument that corn ethanol actually provides a net benefit to the environment."

Click here for this full article. http://tinyurl.com/2mp28g

 

[tcbusch]

Here is another story on Palm oil for Bio Diesel.
Sounds like they are clear cutting the forests.

http://tinyurl.com/2v3eeb

 

[kcrain]

Im all for helping the enviroment and getting away from foriegn oil but reg. unleaded here is 2.84 a gal e-85 is 2.92 a gal and i getless mpg. I think i will stick with my diesel truck fuel is more but mpg's are alot more.

 

[dsauve]

It is begining to sound like the "save the earth switch to ethanol" is relly nothing more than a political statement. I belive that once all the facts are in ethanol from grain of any kind wont be the great savior. Ethanol is a great idea but the logistics aren't working out very well. If people want to save the world there are some very simple things that can be done to conserve fuel. I run the mini van and the car daily getting 30 mpg or so. I have the truck that gets about 15 mpg, I'd rather drive the truck but the gas mileage just doesn't work out. 87 octane isn't the great curse, excesive consumption is. I know we all need our cub haulers, but not for running to the grocery store or just to work.
This seems like an issue that common sense just doesn't apply. Reading the previouse posts everyone is using an usv for these tests. That is part of the problem how many people relly NEED an suv or truck every day?

 

[dsauve]

What happened? Did I break the debate?

 

[bwatson]

Kentuck, not trying to be a smart a**, but how many engines does MTD manufacture? My take is they are talking about premium gasoline vs regular unleaded. Here's another thought. Propane burns comparatively as clean as alcohol and even has about the same octane rating. Engines burning propane don't have carbon build up or crankcase contamination like gasoline fueled engines do. My guess is that if the guy with the 1 mil mile pickup is telling the truth, he's been running it on propane.
When it comes to making gasoline, diesel, etc a portion of the crude oil is burned to provide the heat needed for the refining process. How is this different from E-85?
As far as green house gases and global warming goes, looking at the blizzard conditions today in central Ia combined with total snow fall this season? Sounds like B.S. to me. With all of the pollution controls on vehicles today, the air has never been cleaner in my lifetime.

 

[dsauve]

Brian good point on the propane. The guy that services our forklifts told me that 100 hours was the equivilat of 1000 miles. I have seen lifts with 15000 hours. Granted that had an over haul on it but that is still is 1.5 million miles. I would be suprised to find out his truck ran on propane. Around here finding a refueling station is a problem. Fork trucks are pretty easy but for a truck it presents abit of a challenge.

 

[bwatson]

I have seen some good sized LP tanks mounted in pickups. 50 maybe 75 gal. You're right about filling them though.

 

[mgonitzke]

Brian W.-

Just because Iowa and the rest of the midwest is cold and snowy, don't think that the rest of the world is the same. Here in Daytona Beach it is unseasonably warm for this time of year, and has been for quite some time. It was 82 degrees today, and this isn't the first time this year it's been above 80. On the local news they just said that this was the warmest Daytona 500 in history. If you're going to make a statement like that, you might want to consider that the entire world doesn't consist of Iowa

 

[dsauve]

Here in the cold propane also has bit of a problem with icing, where the truck being to cold to vaporize fuel fast enough. The big fuel tanks are great for range but sure eat up cargo space.

 

[kweaver]

62 degrees here @ midnight and on the 5th it was 72 .... no global warming here ....

We've not had measurable snow in 4 years ........

 

[rporter]

I saw a piece on discover tv or public tv a while back that showed tha Brazil makes their ethanol from sugar cane. the cars run on e 85 and e 100. The e 100 cars have a small gas tank to start the engine with and then switches over to 100% alcohol. I think it says ethanol won't start an engine very well Below 50 some degrees, hence the gasoline! They said Brazil only uses about 15% fossil fuels and has a Goal to be 100% fossil fuel free in the future. Trouble is they Did'nt report on how many acres of forrest they destroyed to grow sugar cane. They also use the cane Pulp to fire their power plants and ethanol plants. I'm not an expert ,just saw it on tv.

 

[bwatson]

Matt, its like this every year in the midwest. Isn't Florida known for its warmer climate than much of the rest of the country...

 

[mgonitzke]

Brian W.-

You completely missed my point. It has been far warmer than normal here. It was 85 degrees yesterday. And like I said before, this was the warmest temperature ever for a Daytona 500. It's supposed to be in the mid 60's to low 70's this time of year, but it's been getting into the lower 80's quite often. Back home in Rockford, Illinois, it was 65 degrees the day I left to go back down here. That was a new record. My parents keep telling me it always used to be much colder in the winter in the midwest than it has been in the last 20 years or so.