Archive through May 21, 2015

[digger]

Mike C.
So your saying that if you ordered from CCS, that it would be the end of June before you got them? BS!

Funny,
In the last 14 days there's been 153 orders come through and EVERY ONE got shipped the SAME or NEXT DAY!

 

[mconway]

charlie...if i got from kaman bearing... end of june....ordered from ccs this afternoon.....

 

[rgiese]

No smoke, but terrible breath choking exhaust.
1973 cc 108 with original engine replaced in the middle 1990's is running great. Starts on first starter turnover.
It doesn't use abnormal oil in 25 hours of use and its next oil change. Carb has been adjusted as per original operation manual with fresh oil and gas always being used.
Timing is next on my remedy check list, but with the prompt startup and no backfiring during use or after shut down I wonder if it might be something altogether different.
Also thinking that the points dwell might be off, but think the symptoms suggest otherwise.
What say guys? Any experience with extremely foul exhaust smell?
As always, thanks in advance and after any forum input.
Richard

"Sometimes it is not enough that we do our best; we must do what is required." Sir Winston Churchill

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[mgonitzke]

Richard G.-

"Extremely foul" is pretty subjective. In what way is it any worse than any other 1950s/60s era engine? I've had a few engines smell different when running after sitting a long time, but that's about it.

You need some race gas or 100LL avgas...that'll make it smell better!

 

[jbaker]

Richard, there very well could be a mouse or mouse nest in the muffler, I have had that before with a mouse storing corn in there. dead mouse cooking with burning corn did in deed stink.

 

[rgiese]

Thanks guys.
The "extremely foul", exhaust is not organic as this started about 2 years ago and is used exclusively for lawn mowing and carrying wood burning logs much of the year. Good idea though. Humm, barbecue while mowing! LOL
The exhaust causes coughing while sitting on and using the mower. It is clear in color but has to be unburned fuel. It is so bad that my coughing lasts about 1/2 hour after stopping.
It is not consistent but varies in intensity sometimes tolerable and others as today when I had to stop asap.
If there was a exhaust sampling gadget available to me I wouldn't doubt that fuel is not being consumed as per engine design.
I am going to get new spark plug even though the current one doesn't appear to be fouled.

 

[rgiese]

Just as a follow up to: "No smoke, but terrible breath choking exhaust."
This cc 180 has been used every year since 1973 and has not been stored for long periods of time and only then with proper "winter storage", stabilizer.

 

[kide]

Richard - you are diagnosing as unburned gas - too rich, but yet you say the plug looks good and it's been doing it for two years? Almost all problems involving too rich or burning too much oil will result in a smoky or oil fouled plug. If you don't have either of these issues with the plug, then it'd be pretty rare to have the problems that would cause them.. Possibly the stabilizer product would stink on the first tank of gas in the spring and I wouldn't use gas that had been stored with stabilizer in it for more than a few months. I've started using ethanol free gas in everything and it's eliminated a lot of issues including over the winter storage and hard starting; I've never noticed foul exhaust, but then I'm a second generation gearhead with about 60 years of thinking exhaust doesn't smell that bad - race gas is almost the best, but two stroke mix with good ol' bean oil is the best!!

 

[nbextermueller]

Richard,

Are you saying that is been doing this for 2 years and you haven't touched the carb? It doesn't really matter if the carb is or was set to the manual's settings. Anything from crappy gas to humidity to elevation will necessitate a carb adjustment. Heck the change from summer blend to winter blend will do it.

Adjust the carb. It's way too rich if its poisoning you just being near it. Get it up to operating temp then set it full throttle. Then slowly screw in the main jet until the engine starts to slow or "go flat". Then back it out 1/8-1/4 turn. Do it a few times just to get the feel for it.

After that, play with the secondary jet or "air bleed" needle.

If you think you have it just right and it dogs when under a good load, you took too much fuel out. Turn out the main jet 1/4-1/2 turn to get good power back.

In drag racing, lean means power. You make the most power right before you melt a piston...

 

[jchamberlin]

Richard: --for what it's worth, I think a mixture that is too lean smells worse than one that is too rich.

If you want to go through the trouble, you can plumb in an O2 sensor connected to a gauge to tell you if you're running rich or lean; race car drivers use them. (I have an LED display from Edelbrock.)

Or, you could just try adjusting the mixture to see if the exhaust seems more tolerable.

Timing can only be checked/verified by checking the timing. I can tell you from experience that the engine will appear to run fine even if it the spark is not perfectly timed; but it will run MUCH better if it is timed correctly. Timing on a single cylinder Kohler can be set statically with a volt-ohm meter or light bulb, and checked dynamically with a timing light. The rod which actuates the breaker points should also be checked for wear; if in doubt, replace it (as well as the points, while you're at it).

Or, it could be the gas. Or it could be the fuel filter or tank strainer partially clogged and restricting flow enough to lean out the mixture.

Just my thoughts on the subject.

Bottom Line: you shouldn't be coughing just because your Cub Cadet is running.

Note: A long time ago, in San Francisco, I experienced a foul smelling 64' Ford Falcon, plugs were orange; turned out to be the carburetor.

 

[rgiese]

Thanks Gerry Ide, Nic Bextermueller and Jeremiah Chamberlin:

Gerry, I have used gasoline and stabilizer that was new about 2-3 months ago. Used 3 tanks full this spring which is about 6 gallons. Will try gasoline without stabilizer and see what gives.
I will try the clean gas and see if that helps. Tnx.

Nic, good idea, but just adjusted carb last weekend. Your outline follows that printed in the Operational Manual. Funny thing, I thought it was running best ever after adjusting carb.
So, will readdress the carb settings and see if that helps. Tnx.

Jeremiah, I will use a DVM and follow up with a timing light.
Makes sense to replace points while in the mix of things. Condensers hardly ever go bad so the points are the third attack plan on my list as well as the point cam. Tnx

I really appreciate the time and effort you all have exhibited on my behalf. I hope I can reciprocate in the future.
Will post my results when the list is completed.
Aren't engines fun?! LOL
Richard

 

[tflynn]

I fabricated an offset "Y" and bolted it under the governor rod by drilling a hole in the arm to get to the phillips screw behind it. Thought it would work but Nope. The next time I'll have the bracket go all the way down and under the bracket that the spring hooks to. Way back in 1963 I hung a bucket under my 1957 Pontiac's tranny to ketch the oil leaking from it; my dad didn't want an oil spot in front of his house.

 

[mgonitzke]

Richard,

When you readjust the carb, be careful not to get it too lean. An air-cooled engine should have a slightly rich mixture or it will run hot. I can't imagine the timing has anything to do with this; if the engine starts easily, runs smoothly, and is developing good power, the timing is fine.

It's also quite possible you've developed an allergy or sensitivity to exhaust fumes. Everyone's body has a different tolerance for things. I've heard of a couple of race car drivers developing an allergy like this and having to quit as a result.

 

[lhinds]

Tom Flynn I think your oil leak is due to a crankcase breather being stopped up. There is a crankcase breather just below the carburetor. Clean and reinstall breather with new gaskets and I feel your oil leak will stop.

 

[kide]

Richard G. :
Just a note, if you by chance do get some gas without ethanol in it, remember that you'll again want to adjust the carb slightly leaner. In adjusting the high speed, I was taught to start with the recommended setting (usually a turn and a half from bottomed out)run the needle in (leaner) until you could hear speed fall off, back it out through the good running range until you found that same point on the rich side and then run it back in just until it cleans up to avoid running too lean and overheating.

One of the things we tend to forget when adjusting small engine carbs is that they are designed for engines that are designed to run at a fixed speed, so all of the designs that went into automobile carbs to accommodate varying speeds, acceleration, clean idle, etc. are pretty much missing. This means that what you always end up with a slightly rich mixture to prevent "bogging" when the load increases or during the transition from idle to running speed. But again, I can't believe you'd not have an issue with the spark plug if it's been bothering you for two years - that would be way too rich to not carbon up the plug..

Too bad Delphi couldn't whip us up a FI system for small engines, but then we'd have O2 sensors, Map sensors, Throttle position sensors and a bundle of snakes wiring to deal with - and we could pay DynoJet to give us a tuner for it...

 

[rgiese]

Gerry Ide:
Morning,
Tnx agn fer ur info.
Not quite sure ethanol gas available to me in this location; anyhow might be better to use ethanol and set up the carb with it since I use the machine all year round.
I would like to clarify that the PS (putrid smell) is not a constant.
On rare occasions there is no PS and others very little. However, as I explained earlier, when it is bad, it is BAD! I try to use the mower when wind blows exhaust from the side or back and not from the front of the machine.
I will take a photo of the plug and attach to next 'reply'.
It is possible that my understanding of "carbonized plug", is outside its definition. Living is learning and learning is living.

Learning right along,
Richard
Have a good and safe day

 

[mconway]

ok...need to clarify what i said and got misunderstood yesterday. for my 42" deck, i tried to find bearing seals for the spindles locally and ended up going to kaman bearing. i took all the parts, old seal and both pieces of the spindle so if they couldn't cross reference the trostel number, they could take dimensions and match up that way. when i said that it would be the end of june for delivery, it must have appeared that i said the end of june if i ordered from ccs. and i heard about it, believe me. anyway...kaman called national bearing in kentucky and was told they could ship 2 seals on june 4 and the remaining 4 on june 9. i said wth... came home and ordered them from ccs yesterday afternoon. and the best part, ccs was $4.81 less per seal than kaman anyway so i should have known...get what the factory used so i did. sorry to have po'd anybody especially ccs. i did get a national number with dimensions and when i get the ones from ccs, i will mic one and compare to the national dimensions just for grins.

 

[rgiese]

Cub Cadet 108 points?:
Anyone know of a cross reference for Cub Cadet 108 points?
Something at NAPA or ? might be just the ticket.
Tnx.
Richard

 

[wshytle]

Richard G.-

I've been reading and thought I'd throw in my .02 worth. I was told years ago by an old timer to use high test. I also use MMO (Marvel Mystery Oil) at about an ounce a gallon as my "stabilizer". By using high test I don't worry so much about bad gas...high test has a longer shelf life or so I've been told. I recently removed the head from a 124 I use often and there was very little carbon. The plug was a little fouled because it is a slight smoker but has always run fine. As for the replacement points I'd just go back with Kohler points. They are getting a little pricey like everything else but I think the extra for something like points is acceptable.

Maybe you could try a few drops of the wifes perfume in with the gas...who knows???

As for the timing, go to Matt Gs. website and check out static timing. He explains it well and once you get the knack it's rather simple and can be done both in the tractor or on the bench.

.

 

[tflynn]

Luther, I think you right because I did notice the opening for the breather is dry. Thanks, I'll give it a try.