Archive through March 29, 2013

[aaytay]

Mike-
You shouldn't have ANY chunks of ANYTHING coming out of your carb like that. It sounds to me like you need to do what I call "the job" to your tractor, which I've had to every tractor I've owned when it first arrives in my garage.

"The job" consists of pulling the entire fuel system apart. I remove the carb, fuel line, and tank. Then dump as much of the gas out of the tank as I can. If it looks to be fresh gas, I'll use a stack of paper-toweling as a "coffee filter" and then dump the gas into a container with the papertowel in the opening of the container to catch any contaminants. After that, the tank gets a good squirt of dish-washing liquid inside, then filled about halfway with warm water. Put the lid back on, plug the outlet hole with your finger and shake like mad. The tank will need MULTIPLE rinsings to get the soap out, and then needs to set in the sun for a good 6-8hrs to dry out.

After that I'll pull the carb apart and see what it looks like inside. If it looks like it needs it, I'll drop it in a can of carb cleaner and stick a rebuild kit in it the next day. Slap it together with a new fuel line and you're good to go. Sometimes you can get away with spraying it down with a can of carb cleaner and putting it back together if it ran fine to begin with.

It seems like every tractor I've ever bought has crap rolling around in the bottom of the tank, and this ensures that the crap never presents a problem in the future. This may be your issue, but even if it isn't what is currently causing your tractor to run poorly, it will give you problems in the future if you don't take care of it now.

Also, look in the bottom of your gas cans to make sure you don't have any contaminants in any of those as well. It would SUCK to do all of this work and then dump crappy gas back in the tank. I make it a habit to look in the bottom of my gas cans just before I refill them. If there's stuff in the bottom of the can, it WILL end up in your carb at the worst possible time.



Reggie-

 

[proessler]

Mike, MMO is @ NAPA & Walmart.

Seafoam @ Bumper to Bumper,US Auto plus, Napa, Auto Sense, CarQuest, Parts Source, Auto Value, & Lordco.

 

[jclazar]

Take a pick and pick out the plastic liner in the gas cap. You will be surprised at the amount crap you will find between there. You will be able to reinstall the plastic liner, if that's what is called.

 

[dschwandt]

This part came w/the original and deck I aquired a few weeks ago.
I haven't a clue where, if anywhere it goes/ Part of the deck hanger maybe??

Dave S

 

[mpatterson]

Ok, so I went back out to remove the bowl from the carb again to drain it - has a little bit of black/brown stuff in it. Less than half of what was in it the first time. Cleaned that out and opened up the fuel shut off valve and let it run out through the carb for a good minute or two. I ended up with almost 2 cups of gas, give or take. I then removed the fuel bowl and cleaned it out too. Re-installed everything and tried to fire it up. NO GO! It would roll over slow without the choke on, throw the choke on and it would turn over faster and back fire gas out the lower hole on the carb (I still had the filter backer plate off, so entire end of carb was open).

This is what it looked like in the fall:
before:

after:

YES, I did change the wire on the condensor to the CORRECT side of the coil! Not really sure what I was thinking there? One of you's had corrected me on that last fall.


So do I go with Reggie's suggestion and strip it down and flush everything out in hopes of solving it? The carb was dropped in to carb cleaner last fall when I installed the new kit and needle I bought from Charlie. That's why it is all nice and clean now in the pictures thanks to the nasty smelling carb cleanter. The valve issue (if there is one) I am a little nervous on doing that one - never tore down a gas engine before. You can rent the tools needed to get the valves out right? I guess I'd be buying Charlie another steak dinner if I get into that job!


Frustrated with the K241 in the 100, I rolled it aside and tore into the 982 with the Onan that is sick. I didn't use it last summer at all since I had to pull the engine on it to get the starter out to clean it. It too is rolling over VERY slow with a fully charged battery and cleaned up posts and grounds. These Onan's DO SUCK when you have to do carb work or starter work, darn near have to strip entire front end of tractor. I will take the cab off too while I have it stripped down and make sure it is not gummed up at all as well. I drained all the gas out of the tank too figured I might as well start with all fresh gas.

These are the old pictures I took the first time I had to do this job - looks the same now in the garage except the bench is MUCH messier!

The "hardend gum" at the end of the starter that holds the wire down tight - is that supposed to be there or is that actually dirt and dust that has collected? It is very brittle. I don't want to clean it off there if its supposed to be there?

Just wondering, what do you guys use to clean your starters with? Electrical aresol or compressed air?? Last time I pulled it about 2 years ago I found alot of dust from the brushes and just old dirt, I am pretty sure its the original starter on it still.

Also, do you guys bench test your engines before re-installing them? If so, what is your set up like to test it? I could run the extra wires needed to get to the starter, but do you bolt it to an engine stand or clamp it to the bench? Its just alot of work putting it back into the 982 frame only to find out it still doesn't run?
Just curious.

MMO - I never thought of checking WalMart! DUH!
Now can I put the MMO into the "low ash" engine oil that I have in the Onan? I was thinking of running the "low ash" oil in the K241 as well - is that a good idea?

Appreciate all the input on my issues guys - just wish you all would come over and help me with it. I'd supply the beer and pizza!

 

[digger]

David S.
Manuals and the Parts Lookup above are wonderful things.

 

[nbartee]

Wayne S. - Too much trouble and possible contamination of the oil, or losing some. Also I'm pissed that I have to replace this seal on a new rebuild!

 

[fcurrier]

Holy Catfish, Mike! Here's a kiss for ya: K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple Stupid).
Now that I've got that off my hairless chest, it's not a big problem to check the valve clearence on these Kohlers. (NFC about an Onan).

You say the carb was dropped into carb cleaner - in one piece? That won't work. If you took it apart and cleaned it the crud in the bowl has to come from the tank. I, personally, like a sediment bowl like you have - I like the feeling of seeing a little bit about what's coming from the tank before it goes to the carb and there's something resassuring about cleaning the glass bowl and thinking "that rust won't reach the carb".

Let's get good fuel flow before we pop the breather cover and check the valve clearances. ?

Thinking: That black crud might be coming from a breakdown of the innards of your fuel line.

Under edit: Listen to Art

 

[dtanner]

David Schwandt

That is the front deck hanger for a timed deck on an Original tractor. I will post a picture later in the spring when I get my deck installed again.

 

[mpatterson]

Frank,
No, the carb was completely stripped down and then dropped into the carb cleaner for about 12 to 14 hours. Anything that could be unscrewed or removed was. I then cleaned it up with the compressed carb cleaner in the aresol can. Then started to reassemble it with the new parts I bought from Charlie. Then it was put back onto the block with a new gasket and then a new air filter and pre-filter was installed.

Yes, I think the clean fuel is an easier step to perform first. If the fuel line is breaking down, I would find that odd. It is a copper line with the compressed fittings on each end. So if I relplace it, can you still buy the small kits they used to sell years ago at Autoparts stores that you cut your own line to length and add the furrels on the end? Haven't looked or seen them in a long time? I'd like to continue to use the copper lines, much neater and I think better than rubber. I notice the new fuel line I put on the Onan a couple years ago is already bubbling, as if its breaking down? That is annoying, considering I paid good money for it at NAPA when I did it.

Below I said "Reggie" I meant to type Art - SORRY!

 

[tbdavis]

Mike - just went through a s/g and was much nastier than the one you had in the pic. I wiped everything off as best possible, hit everything hard with electrical cleaner spray, cleaned the case good with a degreaser and finished by lightly hitting where the brushes contact with 600 grit sandpaper. Make sure any bushings/bearings are cleaned up and lubricated and replace the brushes if needed and all should be good. Oh, not sure about the black goo but I would guess that after a good cleaning you'll have a better idea of what's permanent and what's goo. Hope this helps and good luck getting all that black brush dust off your hands!

 

[tbdavis]

Hey - just wanted to mention (in case anyone cares) that I went ahead and started a thread in the resto/refurb section about my Original project. Hate to keep asking questions here about same ole tractor so seemed only appropriate to center my questions and any comments in one location for reference sake if for no other reason. Thanks

 

[fcurrier]

Mike: Let's go here: (Pee, open new beer).

Copper line, black crud. Rubber bushings breaking down?

Engine gets warm & quits. Bad coil? Bad condensor? I guess this is why we need more than 1 - one that runs OK that we can swap parts out for the one that's aggravating us.
We all have our "DUH" times. You're gaining on yours.

 

[mpatterson]

Frank,
Already on my 2nd Whiskey!

There are rubber bushings in the line ends? OR your talking about a gasket or o-ring that is between the sediment bowl and the tank? I am only asking, incase I should be planning on replacing the copper line to be done with it when I take off the tank to clean it out like Art suggested? I am going to end up with two stripped tractors in the garge aren't I?

Where is Dennis when you need him - he has stripped his 982 down I am sure. Hopefully get at least ONE of them running soon.

If I was to get another Cub, it had better have heat on it, cause the wife would be kick'n my fat butt out the door!

Terry:
So what your saying is don't eat potatoe chips or lick my fingers while cleaning the starter up?

 

[thoffman]

Mike,
IMHO Frank has it. I had the same problem with the rubber bushing. Try this; disconnect the fuel line from the intake side if the carb and open the shutoff valve leave it for a bit and make sure you have good flow. If you don'thave a good flow, give you tank a good B.J. <font size="-2">(Is it wrong??)</font> to see if you can blow out the disolving rubber bushing material.

 

[fcurrier]

Mike, did you miss Cub Cadet 101? My bad. There's rubber bushings on both ends of that copper gas line. Tell me you knew that?
If we keep going long enough the Archive Bug won't bite someone.

TOM: In this context - IT'S NOT WRONG!!

 

[lcarter]

I agree with Frank (from the beautiful state of Maine) and others, you possibly have crud from the line or the tank that is clogging up the carb that you cleaned. Don't know about gas and copper but I know that if you look at old copper water lines, they are black inside. You may have to clean the carb again, then prior to starting it again remove the fuel line at the carb and slowly and carefully fill up the bowl with fresh gas (may take awhile to slowly fill up the bowl).

I have attached an air cooled engine to a bench to test it by filling up the bowl with gas. Just make sure you have a way to turn it off quickly if needed. I used 2 appropriate length 2x4's with countersunk holes to attach bolts and nuts to the engine mounting holes then used deck screws to hold the 2x4's to the bench. Check the manuals for the wiring but IIRC use a jumper from battery + to the coil. Then using jumper cables from a battery to the engine, ground the engine and touch the positive to the appropriate terminal on the starter (seems as if it is harder for me to envision exactly without having it in front of me as I get older),so if I left something out please correct me.

Others also may need to help me on this as far as engines with the starter/generator and if this would harm it. If it has a magneto make sure you know which wire to ground to turn it off.

Under edit:
You may also have to fashion something to hold the throttle and choke in position.

 

[rwoods]

OK, The 169 performed great today. Aerated a little over an acre today.

 

[jbaker]

Reggie,, I like it,,the 169 looks good,,
now keep posting pics

 

[thoffman]

Frank,
Just being P.C. here.