2072 Rear End Frame Bolts

[ssheils]

Well I finally got the lift linkage figured out for my new/used 2072 and it lifts the 450 blower and holds it up just fine. The hydraulics seems excellent.

Now the rest of the story. Many broken rear end frame bolts. Not sure if there are 4 bolts or six bolts that bolt trough the frame into the rear end. Many are broken and missing. The tractor is unusable until they are fixed.

So.... how to fix. Looks like nothing short of removing the rear end and drilling into the bolts to get them out. My worst fear is the axel carriers may have to come off to get to the broken bolts. Seems like the very end of the threads are broken off. I have access the family farm shop and a great deal of tools. Just looking for any tips to help in this situation. Any sort of easy out tools better than others? Also for those of you that may have encountered this same problem. Did you have to remove the axel carriers to get to the broken bolts? Any info would be helpful.

Thanks, Steve

 

[aaytay]

Steve-
The easiest way, in my opinion, to remove broken bolts is to weld a nut onto the end of the bolt and then back them out. (if you have access to a welder)

Obviously that would entail removing the transmission from the tractor, but on the plus side, those bolts probably didn't break off because they are stuck, but rather because someone ran the tractor with them loose, so they should back right out.

Best of luck, keep us posted on your progress.....

 

[agitch]

If you can't use the weld method I would just use an easy out. Like was mentioned they will probably come out fairly easy

 

[wmiller]

Steve, If you drill,use a left hand drill bit. Often times a left hand bit will "catch" enough to back them right out.

 

[dtanner]

Steve Sheils
I did repair an 1862 rear end and I had to remove the rear end from the tractor, drain and pull the axles and remove the casings to get at the broken bolts. I did chase the threads and found that the bolt was damaged at the end. I found that the threads did not go all the way through and there was a lump above the hole that was left when the caseing was made. I did weld a nut on the broken bolt and removed it that way as I tried to drill and use a bolt extractor and broke two before grabbing the welder. good luck I do have a few pictures I could post. Later Don T

 

[ssheils]

Well it was not a good day. I removed the rearend. I could not drill the broken bolts through the frame. Had to removed the oil, axel carriers, and axels.

Bad to worse. There are two bolt on either side of the hydro in front of the rear end. The left side of the casting was broken and not holding the rear in place. When I bought I thought it tipped easy to one side. Should have paid closer attention! All bolts on that side are broken. I have a fix designed for the forward pair- will just gusset more metal to the bracket and drill more holes into the case.

Now the bolts through frame and rear axel carriers. Three out of four were broken. These are Grade eight bolts. There is some kind of red thread lock on them. I could not budge them with an "easy out" left turn type of a device. They are in very mean and all broke off deep into the damn rear end with no hope of welding anything to them. Bitch is I can't get at them from the inside either. So I tried to drill them. Score now stands at one broken bolt out with ruined threads and one drilled but still can't get it out. Broke a small piece of the case on the second miserable SOB and still can't get it to budge. I've been trying small chissels trying to gouge into the bolt and drive it around and out- the things don't budge. Have not tried the third one yet. Starting to look desperate. I got a grand wrapped up into this tractor/mower/thrower all ready and it is not looking good.

My local cub dealer is just one 1/8th of a mile where I live- Oh the temptations! He was there on Sunday. I showed the axel-less case to him- he said to keep at it and use Heli-coils if threads won't clean up. I have never used a Helicoil. Any advise on them?

Any advice on any of this? I may have to get it to a machine shop but I don't even know where to start finding a good machine shop in our area.

By the way- there are a lot of metal filings getting all over and inside the case. The gummy Hytran residue hangs onto them and a magnet won't pull them out. What do you guys suggest to clean and flush the case. My Pa said he has a gas sprayer- liquid in the sprayer and hook to air hose. Any other suggestions. I can't even stomach thinking about the filings getting into the bearings and such.

Steve

 

[aaytay]

Steve-
Ugh! That sounds like a rough go...

Look at it this way, you now know what's wrong, and at least have the tractor apart. Once it's together again it will be good as new.

Honestly, if it were mine, I would cut my losses, pop out the differential bearing caps and remove the diff, so you're left with an empty case.......and toss it in the garbage.

Pullers are always looking for these tranny internals, so your options would be to find an <FONT COLOR="ff0000">I</FONT><FONT COLOR="000000">H</FONT> cast-iron case and put your internals in it, or find another good used transmission and sell the internals you have now.

Again, this is just my opinion. I've done the "swap the aluminum tranny case with a cast-iron" one before. I can tell you it wasn't fun, but once I was done with it I didn't have to worry about it any longer.

Sorry to hear the bad news.....

 

[junderwood]

Steve,

The other option would be to drill them out completely and install a steel thread insert. These are better than a Helicoil but the same result. Look them up in Mcmaster Carr, Grainger, or a local auto parts store might have them. You need to get the inserts first to make sure you don't drill the hole too big. I would also suggest a Cobalt drill bit since the bolts are grade 8. Use that and a lot of cutting oil.

As far as cleaning it just some good old brake clean works well. I flush mine out every time I change the hytran. You could also use Diesel fuel or Kerosene first. Don't use Gasoline for cleaning anything. Way too dangerous.

 

[jdiederichs]

The red Loctite needs to be heated in order to budge, I went through that also. Even an electric heat gun and some patience will be enough, a propane torch works better.

As mentioned previously, get a sharp cobalt bit, 1/4" works well or slightly smaller even, center the bit and make that pilot hole. If the bolts are not flush, but in deeper you can make a centering tool by centering a hole in a grade 5 or better bolt. Do that in your drill press. thread it into the hole and drill away, grade 8's take time.

Once you've drilled the hole, take a socket wrench tool with the allen or torx bit in after the area is heated, drive it into the drilled hole and spin the piece out. These work well without expanding the bolt as much as an easy-out.

For holes worn too large to rethread, use a thread insert Heli Coil or better and you have steel threads. Second option is to tap the hole for a 7/16" capscrew, grade 8 of course. You may even find some with the hex portion drilled for safety wire, if so you can drill a small hole to anchor the safey wire in the frame; they won't back out again!

 

[ssheils]

Thanks for the ideas gentlemen! My dad is going to take the cae up to the dealer today to have them look at it. I know the left side two holes will need to have thread inserts placed into them. The case does not look so good where the ol'man put heat to it. The alloy case bubbled in a few spots.

Some one wrote put a caststeel case on it and change the internals. Is this possible? This is the 2072 super garden tractor model with the rear differential. If it is possible maybe I can look for an alternative case after we bubble gum this back together? Either that or I'll part the SOB out.

We'll keep at it for now.

Steve

 

[hschroeder]

In the latest Cub Connection magazine, there is an article about a person with a Cub 1872 that had bolt hole problems in his aluminum rear end. He solved his problem by getting a cast iron rear end from a Cub 149, and replacing the innards with those of the Cub 1872. Claims it is working well with no problems.

 

[kmcconaughey]

And if you look down this page you'll see where Art mentioned that he has done the swap of an aluminum case for a cast iron one as well...

 

[dtanner]

Steve Sheils
I did manage to weld nuts fast to the broken bolt on the 1862 I repaired for a friend.When I saw the 1512 I bought I did check the bolts first to see if I would have to repair any. I was lucky as if the bolts are not kept tight they will break. I do have a 107 here that will donate the cast case and swap the gears over, you will need the right type of axle tubes to use your Brakes with the rotors you have now. If you look at my 1512 post back a few you will see where I posted the right set up for them. Good luck with your tractor. Later Don T

 

[fcurrier]

Steve: In the interest of the common good, if you want to do the research on compatibility and pay the shipping, I can "donate" a 149 cast rear end. Without the guts, I bet UPS would be pretty reasonable. IF the 149 rear will work, I honestly think it would be a viable route to persue. Wow, look at all the big words!

 

[ssheils]

Frank and Don, thanks for the kind offers. I'm waiting to see what my dealer says about the case. He is a good mechanic and says the case is easily salvageable. We'll see. I should know by early next week. If there is doubt as to the strength of the case when repaired I may just mow lawn with the big bruiser and get a walk behind snow thrower. It would be a hell of a let down though. The 450 snow thrower I got in the deal is in perfect shape- can't even here the thing run. Dealer could not believe how nice it is. I'll keep you post on my status.

Steve

 

[agitch]

You could get an entire used rearend for pretty cheap. They're usually all over epay and some other sites.

 

[ssheils]

Well it's been a tough go at fixing the rearend. One bolt whole was near hopeless. Cub Cadet dealer took the rear case to a local welder who fill the whole and then they redrilled it. They got it off pattern.

Then they drilled the axle carrier bolt hole out to fit the off center bolt hole in the case. I put it together in the the frame and filled with oil. Oil came out the bad whole. Cub dealer said I overfilled it.

Here is the question. The specs (I looked them up today

) say the rear takes 7 quarts. That is the total amount of Hytran for the rear end and the hydro? I probably did put more than 7 quarts in the case but not much more. It never registered on the the dip stick. I put the dip stick tube back in the rear case but could not bottom the threads on the tube. The top wide opening where the dipstick cap goes hit the battery box area. Probably half an inch of threads still showing above the rear case. Is this OK or should it be seated all the way down.

Let me know. Thanks!

Steve

 

[junderwood]

Steve,
Sounds like you need a new dealer. If they can't drill the hole in the right place they don't know what they are doing. If that was me I would have had it welded up again and redrilled it right at my expense. Did you try putting thread sealant on the bolt? That might keep it from leaking.

 

[ssheils]

I believe the old tractor is going to make it! Got it back together but it was not pretty.

John Underwood- I know what you mean by switching dealers. I was not impressed with their final solution and subsequent misaligned hole drilled into the case. But they are otherwise great people to deal with.

All the bolts are back in- it's on four wheels. No leaks from the rearend yet.