Well, I'll be the first to welcome all of you Cub Cadet enthusiasts. I hope you all have a fun time here and let us know what is on your mind. I have lined up a couple of guys who are quite knowledgeable in the Cub Cadet world to answer questions for us. An old IH parts guy has been a wealth of info and we'll try to answer questions and pose a few of our own along the way. We do not claim to be a complete storehouse of knowledge but rather would like to serve as a clearing house for information, sources of old Cub Cadets for those wanting to get one, new and used parts sources, reproduction parts,and restoration resources. If you haven't already, visit http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cubcadet.htm

Brad Boyd - 10:26pm Mar 5, 1998 EST (#2 of 797)
Hey Bob, You 'll probably see a lot of familiar names from Bill Marrison's pulling forum. Does anyone make aftermarket decal sets? What color white is a good sub to use that is made by Sherwinn-Williams? I'm building a stock puller 1968 model 124. Good Day.B.B.

Brad - 01:40pm Mar 6, 1998 EST (#3 of 797)
I'm selling a mid 70's Cub Cadet model 149. It's in average to good condition, a few blemishes here and there; but overall a good tractor. It's got hydraulic lift and a 50" deck. What is the market value of this tractor? Are the original repair manuals still available? I'd like to be able to tune it up and do a few minor things to it before I sell it, but I don't want to take it to the dealer. Thanks.

Bob Necker - 06:08pm Mar 6, 1998 EST (#4 of 797)
Hey Brad Boyd and Brad;
Welcome aboard. I'm sure someone is gonna help you out with that 149. Brad Boyd, I slaved over a hot computer today and came up with a few goodies for you too. Not much on the Sherwin Williams paint though. There doesn't seem to be any one in this part of the country that handles the automotive and other industrial products. I have been told that Martin Seynour and NAPA brand both are made by Sherwin Williams. For what that's worth ! ! Check out the new page on paint. http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cubpaint.htm Just for you Brad. We aim to please ! ! Anybody want to help us out on those decals? Where is the best place to get them? Let me know and I'll get it posted.

Doug Valley - 06:35pm Mar 6, 1998 EST (#5 of 797)
Hi from N.H. Well I've got a couple of Cub Cadets, one I've been building up since last summer. its the early model, belt to the clutch shaft. I don't believe it would make a good puller but, don't get me wrong I love a good tractor pull. I'm building this into a "MONSTER MOWER" as I call it. now I am not a speed freak but I am a little daring. Me and some friends are starting a club called "MONSTER MOWERS". This is not based on just speed, but rather an obstacle course... a little sand,hills and mud, against the clock, best time wins...knock over a cone, and you lose time. Of course, all safety gear. Well, if your not rolling on the floor let me know if anybodys heard of any thing like this. Oh by the way... I call this cub cadet.. "MID LIFE CRISIS"

yardbird - 06:35pm Mar 6, 1998 EST (#6 of 797)
For a great place to get parts for almost any make of engine, lawnmower-tractor, or go-cart parts visit Yardbird lawn And Garden in Houghton Lake. Servicing all brands and now we handle racing Go-carts. In our first year of stock alcohol 5 HP Briggs carts we started late in the season and took 2nd place championship.. Engine and mechanical Experience pays check us out we just have a new webpage http://webatola.com/yardbird/home.html

RON KELLER - 11:51am Mar 7, 1998 EST (#10 of 797)
THE MODEL 86 WAS MADE FROM 1971 TO 1974. IT'S A WIDE FRONT THAT LENDS IT SELF GOOD FOR PULLERS BECAUSE THE WIDER FRAME ALOWS A BIGGER MOTOR. THE PANELS ARE ALSO REMOVABLE UNLIKE EARLIER YEARS. HOPE THAT HELPS.. RON

If you're interested there are some pics of my tractor, mostly involving the restoration of the mower deck here.
http://www.riverport.org/knowles/prj_cadet.html
The main tractor restoration comes next.
http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cubtoys.htm

Tom Hoffman - 09:24am Mar 11, 1998 EST (#32 of 799)
I a have the parts # for the hood side decals. They are from Cub Cadet 2750813R1. The dash decal is #2750805R3. I'm told that the old Cub Cadet white is now CASE/IH # 935, and the old yellow is CASE/IH Federal yellow. LATER TOM

Tom Hoffman - 06:31pm Mar 11, 1998 EST (#33 of 799)
QUESTIONS FOR ALL CUB CADET OWNERS.............. I've been told by a old IH/Cub Cadet dealer that the Cub Cadet was test marketed in the Chicagoland area in 1959. They tested about 100 of them. The serial # charts show the the first Cub Cadet had a serial # of 590. So if IH tested the first 90 would they have serial #'s? Prototypes? If a person had the # 590 Cub Cadet wuold it be the first one or the first marketed one?

RON KELLER - 07:16pm Mar 11, 1998 EST (#34 of 799)
IF ANYONE IS LOOKING FOR PARTS TO RESTORE THEIR CADET OR KEEP THEIR DAILY MOWER GOING TRY MADSON'S GARAGE IN ST NAZIANZ WI THERE PHONE # IS 1-920-773-2661.
MADSON'S GARAGE
114 S 2ND AVE
ST NAZIANZ WI 54232
ASK FOR SCOTT.
THEY HAVE LOTS OF USED PARTS REAR ENDS, MOTORS FRAMES AND SHEET METAL. THEY ALSO HAVE SOME NOS. THEY SELL NEW CADETS ALSO. RON

Bob Necker - 07:38pm Mar 11, 1998 EST (#35 of 799)
You are right on those decal numbers Tom. How does that check out with your info Rick? Also the paint numbers are correct. The number of the Original yellow is 483-B. Be sure to specify that you want the IHC Cub Cadet paint color and decals. Some Cub Cadet (MTD) dealers either do not have access to this information or are unwilling to go to the trouble to look it up. The CASE IH dealer near here is also the Cub Cadet (MTD) dealer so they have access to both sets of info. They have the decals (special order) and paint available. Correct paint available in quarts or rattle can, $10.28 and $4.30 respectively.
Rick, I'll be ordering some of those decals from you as soon as you get everything together and hope all the rest of you do the same. The support for this site and the forum has been great. I hope all of you are enjoying it as much as I am. Putting it all together has been a lot of fun and getting this information in one place, hopefully will help all of us. I sure want to thank Rick for all his help. Were it not for him, this site would problably not exist. Keep up the good work. :)
Also, I have a log on this site and if there is any interest in viewing it let me know. Other than the US, Australia, Canada, Iceland,Netherlands, and Norway are representative of the visitors to the site. We would sure like to hear from you folks out there and have input from your country. Let us know all about your 'imported' Cubs.
What else do you want to see on this site and I'll try to get it done for you. Bob

Tom Hoffman - 10:35pm Mar 11, 1998 EST (#36 of 799)
Bob, How would it work if you had a talk line like they have on Y.T., Antique Tractors,etc. LATER TOM

Tom Hoffman - 10:48pm Mar 11, 1998 EST (#37 of 799)
BY THE WAY,,,,,,,, the reason I've asked the questions about the serial #'s is because I brought #590 home to day! Could it be???

Bob Necker - 12:01am Mar 12, 1998 EST (#38 of 799)
Tom:
Be sure to tell us all about your new treasure. Pictures too ! All reference material I have lists SN 590 as beginning number for International Cub Cadet. Are you the proud owner of # ? ? Numero uno
After all, this is the issue that started this forum.
Nice work Tom. :)

Rick Goodman - 07:14am Mar 12, 1998 EST (#39 of 799)
Hi Everyone, Bob, thanks for the compliment. It has sure taken off much better than we expected. Credit that to all of those who are using the site and especially you guys who are writing in. Bob and I have kinda used our wives as a point of humor at times, but I think we need to get them involved on here too. Lets face it, if they get hooked, they won't care how much time or money we spend on our(but let them think it's their) toys!! Ron, The I H emblems are regretfully all plastic, but brand new.$10.00 will get you one and I'll buy the stamp. Let me know.Tom, glad to hear someone finally found that #590. I was trying to buy it myself a few months ago, as it was advertised , but no one knew where it was! However, one of our books we use at the shop claim that they started with # 501. I'll do some more checking. I hope I'm wrong, but at least those of us who saw the ads for #590 do know that is DOES exist. Congratulations, you should be proud to own it! Till next time, Rick

Rick Goodman - 11:04pm Mar 12, 1998 EST (#40 of 799)
I'm Baaack, Is it bowling night or what? Oh well, as promised, here is a complete list of Cub Cadet paint part #'s available at your friendly Cadet dealer: 759-3263 Old Cadet Yellow quart can 759-3264 Old Cadet Off-White quart can 759-3258 Old Cadet Yellow spray can 759-3259 Old Cadet Off-White spray can 759-3261 Hi-Temp Flat Black spray can 759-3262 Gloss Black spray can 759-3260 Red spray can The following numbers are for the newer Cadet tractors s/n 800,000 and up and lawn mowers s/n 170,601 and up: 759-3589 Cadet Yellow quart can 759-3588 Cadet Yellow spray can 759 3735 Cadet Beige spray can I forgot to get the quart part# for the Cadet Beige, but we don't need it for the old iron we've got anyway. However, the new paint colors do look really good on the older tractors. We had a customer do a 100 in the new shades and it turned out nice. Just a bit of current Cadet Trivia, Did you 1997 was the last year for the garden tractor and super garden tractor as we know it? Yep, MTD in all their wisdom(yeah right), have come up with a totally redesigned tractor similar to the 2000 series. They call it the 3000 series with a shaft driven deck and vacuum operated PTO clutch. It looks like a beefier 2000 tractor with a whole new trans-axle and 4 bolt wheels. Please bow your heads for a moment of silence as we will miss our old friend! Later, Rick

Rick Goodman - 11:14pm Mar 17, 1998 EST (#51 of 799)
Brad,Brad,Brad, Shame on you!!!! Have you considered how old that 149 is? Most brand new dept. store mowers don't last 6 years, let alone the 15+ years your mower had on it when you bought it. How many transmission drive belts have you replaced in the past 6 years? We get the "it's just an MTD" thing alot at the shop and the fact is, Cub Cadets are a separate deal from the MTDs. The garden tractors are as good if not better than when I H built them. The hydros are much smoother andthey all last forever. We have customers who can destroy an anvil with a tack hammer and even they can't tear out a hydro! The cast front axle and spindles are much stronger than the old IH versions. Granted the aluminum engines may not out live the old reliable K-series Kohlers, but at least Cadet uses AMERICAN built engines. J D uses a lot of those Kawasaki rice burners and a lot of belts. Cadet does use 1 Kaw in their line-up but it's a water-cooled version. We just got a new 3000 Series Cadet which replaces the good ole garden tractors and I'll have to admit all in all I like it. It even has a shaft driven deck with power steering and hydraulic lift as standard equipment. At least go and take a look at the 3000 series before you make your choice. Just remember in 37 years when you look out in the garage you can say I've got one of the first year runs of Cub Cadet's totally redesigned 3000!!! Hey it may sound crazy, but look at all of us trying to grab up the 37 year old Originals. If we only knew then.......
Getting off my soap box for a minute, John, I hate to say it but the grille screens and hood ornaments are NLA( the 3 dreaded letters a restorer hates to see). As for your pulleys and timing belt, if properly adjusted and aligned, they should not give you much trouble. They are still available though. Just make sure the teeth in the pulleys are not worn, or you will have a problem with it eating belts( just like a J D ). Well, before I say something I should'nt (oops, probably too late ) I'd better be going. Till next time, Rick

Brad - 08:01am Mar 18, 1998 EST (#52 of 799)
Rick -- I didn't realize that the new Cub Cadets were that much different than the cheapie MTD's. The 149 was very reliable, I was just ready to get something newer, cleaner, and less maintenence. What I really want is the John Deere 325, but the best price I could get is $5400. I found a 318 for $3500 that only has 300 hours on it, so that's the one I'm buying. It has power steering and dual hydraulics, and since I only have 1/2 acre, it's more than I'll need. Here's a question to any mechanic out there....Anyone know how to adjust the seat on the John Deeres to get a little more leg room? Even when they're all the way back, my knees are cramped. Thanks!

Bob Necker - 08:47am Mar 18, 1998 EST (#53 of 799)
Brad:
I have to agree with Rick about the new Cub Cadets being a cut above the rest of the (MTD) lineup. Pun intended. They truly are well built machine. Maybe not as simple or as easy for the average person to repair as the Originals or even as cute, but nevertheless a quality piece of equipment. You might want to check out the true origins of that green machine and also see if your old tool set will work on it. As for seat adjustment, better look on the green forum. If it's answers to questions about the Cub Cadet, now, here's the place. That green paint sure is expensive ! !

Bob Necker - 03:08pm Mar 18, 1998 EST (#54 of 799)
Brad:
Maybe you could get some foot pegs or forward controls for that green lawn mower. Or, better yet go to your local Cub Cadet dealer and fit yourself on a new cushy 3000. I'll bet you'll find leg room and comfort exceeding your old 149. (Just watch out so you don't fall asleep on it !) And, fer Gawd's sake, don't take the wife along or you'll be gettin' one delivered and never get to play with it.
Gotta give you a bit of a hard time, Brad ! I've got some of that green stuff around too ! There shall be no 'color' discrimination on this forum ! (As long as it's yallar an' wite.)

Ralph Olbon - 09:58pm Mar 18, 1998 EST (#55 of 799)
Hey guys, I asked this question once before and did'nt get any answers, so I thought Id try it again. Do'es anybody know if there is a book,catolog,etc. with pictures of the different models of cub cadets, and the options that came with them(1961-1979) Thanks Ralph

Ralph:
I'll answer this question head-on. The very reason this site exists is to answer your question. It came about because a couple guys got to wondering about the same thing you are. Pretty soon it was four or five guys e-mailing one another and exchanging info about their Cub Cadets. Pretty soon there was a bunch of info that we thought others should know about. And here it is. We are still young and growing. The acceptance and support for this site has been overwhelming. Our log shows that we have about 95 regular visitors and more than 700 casual visitors since the launch of our site on February 8, 1998.
To the best of my knowledge and some other Cub Cadet sources there is no known complete, concise body of printed work that documents or in any way gives a history or background of the Cub Cadet. The information available on the Cub Cadet Unofficial Homepage is obtained from IHC advertising, parts manuals, operators manuals and other verifiable sources.
Any information you may have that will help us to put together the very document you seek will be accepted. Old advertising is great. Sometimes a prototype will show up in advertising prepared well in advance of the actual public release date and an obvious change was made . Old parts and operators manuals are readily available and any deviations or anomalies to these standards we would like to hear about. (Now just where did you say that serial number was ! ?) The site is grateful for the input of some very knowledgeable folks. Their savvy on the Cub Cadet covers the spectrum from current day Cub Cadet technicians to an old time IHC parts guy. Gotta remember he wasn't an old guy 37 years ago! Lots of the early Cub Cadets were "ridden hard and put away wet" so if you find that mint serial number 501 be sure to let us know.

Rick Goodman - 12:00am Mar 19, 1998 EST (#57 of 799)
Thanks guys, It's good to get a little support now and then in this world of "I'll just keep my mouth shut". Brad, That $5400 plus a few more(hundred) will get you an 18 hp. 3000 tractor with a 54" deck. Power steering, hydraulic lift, tilt wheel, shaft driven deck,and enough leg room for Shaq all come as standard equipment. The best part is, it's not green! OK, if you already bought I hope you get along well.To each his own. keep us informed how you get along.
Ralph, if I get time before spring field work I am going to try to go through the parts books and attachments books 1 model at a time and compile what options were available. It sounds like more of a winter time project,but we'll see how it goes. I also have a couple of gentlemen the check with who may or may not be doing some research on old garden tractors.
Thanks again to Bob for coming to my defense. I was at the local FFA department this evening for an adult farmer meeting. The topic was the internet and people got to work with it hands on.I soon became a celebrity when I showed this site and there big as life was my name on the forum. Now I am the "expert" at the internet! If they only knew!!! Gotta go for now, Rick

Scott Strance - 09:01pm Mar 19, 1998 EST (#58 of 799)
Growing up our family had a mid-70's cub, hydrostatic, big deck etc. Loved that unit. I've restored a 'green' 8hp model and enjoyed that project and it's time to move on to the real machines.....
Does anyone have leads on 12-15hp cubs w/decks for sale for restoration? Not interested in anyones junk, just a solid platform to put some time into. Thx!

Rick Goodman - 09:54pm Mar 19, 1998 EST (#59 of 799)
Welcome Scott,
Glad to hear you know what a "real" garden tractor is. Let us know where you live so we can help you find something to get started with. Hope you don't live anywhere in Montana near Bob cause you don't stand a chance. That guy must have radar to sniff out those hidden treasures!
John, thanks for the e-mail. Sounds like you are on the right track. The manuals should help you with your tractor and the one your dealer has will be lots of help as well.
As for the search for the metal I H emblem that goes on the grille, plastic ones are all I can get new. I tried ordering 2 different part #'s but both are plastic. They are a bit different though and the parts book listed both as optional. Not sure if that meant they were an option or if they may have used either one as a production option and give 2 choices so you can match the one yours came with??? If anyone knows the answer to this one please let us know. Guess thats all I've got for now, Rick

Peter Knowles - 10:36pm Mar 19, 1998 EST (#60 of 799)
Hi All,
It snowed here in Nova Scotia so I had a chance to get the 122 out and plow my very long drive, what a blast! I love going wide open so that the snow curls off the blade in a nice steady flow.
I'm looking for both the steering wheel and seat for my 122. My MTD dealer thinks they are NLA. Have I any other options? I suppose I could have the wheel rebuilt, is this costly?
Peter by-the-sea Knowles

Tom Hoffman - 09:11pm Mar 20, 1998 EST (#61 of 799)
I was talking to a couple of "Old Timers" at the Toy/Tractor show last weekend, and I was told that the first Cub Cadets were red! The decision to develop a Garden-type tractor was made in February 1960. They also had sheet metal from the CUB fuel tank as the hood! I found some info that said that the fisrt Cub Cadets were to be called "Cub-Urban", "Ranch-All" and later in the development the "Cub-ette". It was released in November 1960 as the "7hp. CUB-ETTE Tractor"! More info as I can find it!!!!! LATER TOM

Jim Gilboy - 10:49pm Mar 21, 1998 EST (#66 of 799)
Just got back from a parts run to BURLINGTON, WI. Otter Sales & Service has a huge back room of donor Cub Cadets, and a darn good inventory of OEM parts. My "shift shaft" broke, and since they did not have a used replacement, ( new one : $ 90.00 )they were nice enough to weld & repair mine!!! ( 1967 "102" 10h.p.) I talked with Kurt & Brad who run the business. For hard to find parts call them at 414-763-3563. This is a real unsolicited testimonial !!! Jim G.

Brian Severns - 10:57pm Mar 21, 1998 EST (#67 of 799)
I just found this forum and I think its great. I am a garden tractor puller in northern In. I also get questions as to why so many cubs(I have an original,two 102's,three 122's,a 100,and a 1000). Interesting info on the originals,is it possible that the test market started with number 500 ,since someone said it consisted of 90 tractors,and then regular production models started with number 590? I never have looked at the serial numbers , but I will have to check them all now that there is a place for me to look. I am looking for a hood ornament for my original and have had noluck,also would like some cadet hub caps if anyone has a set to part with. I purchased a decal set for the original but it is not quite right, the hood decals are not the same as the ones in the cadet repair manual, yes I drive the Case dealer nuts looking up parts. Now when I go there they just hand me the book and I find what I need, they keep telling me I could get my own copy of the manual for around forty bucks. Well I have run on long enough, Brian

Rick Goodman - 10:29pm Mar 25, 1998 EST (#81 of 799)
Jared, You are right about having the first hydro Cub Cadet tractor built. I have a 122 and would love to have a 123 to go with it someday. As for the oil and filter, please use a Cadet hydro filter on it. There are many "will fit" filters out there and some after market brands such as NAPA,but these don't have the right micron filtering properties and in some cases, the right bypass pressure relief. As for the oil, you should also use either Case IH Hy-Tran fluid or Cub Cadet's Hydraulic/Transmission fluid. They are both the exact same oil in different bottles. We use the Case IH brand here at home in our I H farm tractors, it just depends which one you have access to. I recommend you change the filter once a year and the oil every two to three years, depending on how much you use it. Since you just bought it, I would definately change it now because it's hard to tell how long that stuff has been in there! The system holds 7 quarts with the filter and on just a filter change you will probably lose only about a quart.
Tom, I fugured out the hood ornament deal about 2 weeks ago. We have 3 IH tractors with the doggone things on them, and I have sat for hundreds of hours starring right at them and didn't even realize what I had been looking at!! I have an extra hood for one of our IH 656 tractors and walked by it a couple of weeks ago ( to go work on the Original ) and that's when the light finally came on in that thick head of mine. I have already aquired a few, so if anyone needs a hood ornament for an Original let me know, I have some.
It's good to see some new people on the forum and you guys are doing a great job with your fact finding missions. I wrote to C.H.Wendel to see if he had anything on the IH Cub Cadets but with all his research on IH and farm tractors in general, he has nothing. Guess it's up to us!!
Later, Rick

eric knotts - 10:31pm Mar 29, 1998 EST (#86 of 799)
I have a 1971 cadet and im in dire need of a engine. It came with the 7hp (k161). Question, will any other size engine fit on this year tractor. Please let me know at Jascoeric@aol.comThank you very much ps Im located in atlanta ga.

Tom Hoffman - 09:53pm Mar 31, 1998 EST (#87 of 799)
Eric, The Original Cub Cadets had what was called a replacement engine, in case the standard went south. It is called the K-181. This engine is a 8hp. model. It looks a little different from the K-161 and usually has the side moounted air cleaner like the mobel 70.
Does anyone know how to tighten the front clutch on a 100? The finger at the end of the adjusting rod is now against the grill and it's slipping. Will the clutch from a 12hp. engine fit the shaft?

RON KELLER - 10:10pm Apr 2, 1998 EST (#94 of 799)
That dash would be for a 1961-63 also need a new set of 4.80 x 8.00 rib all weather front tires made by good year. There the tires originally on the front of the 61-3 regulars. Good Year product code 202-076-388. thanks

Wayne Harkleroad - 04:59pm Apr 10, 1998 EST (#112 of 800)
I talked to a gentleman today from Cub Cadet by the name of Terry Watson. He is a regional manager from Virginia to New York. Terry has been around Cubs since they were first introduced, his dad had an IH dealer way back then. Terry told me that the first serial number was 501 just like all the other IH tractors. I asked him about the color of red being on the first 89 and he said that they have always been yellow and white. The engineer that was responsible for the design of the Original was a man by the name of Bob Carlson, who is supposed to still be alive. Also a man named Russ Decker was VP of sales back then had a lot to do with the design too.

Tom Hoffman - 10:26pm Apr 10, 1998 EST (#113 of 800)
Hey Wayne, what do you think the chances of getting a hold of Bob Carlson would be? It sure would be interesting reading!! As I'm hearing it now the first 3-4 were painted red, and the big wigs didn't like them that way. So they went to the Industrial paint scheme.(federal yellow)

Rick Goodman - 09:26pm Apr 11, 1998 EST (#114 of 800)
Happy Easter Eve, Jared, just paint the grille with a good aluminum spray paint. It'll look just fine.
Tom, It may be a stretch, but if you painted the motor and put the condensor back on, it may not be grounded good enough to run at high idle. a bad or improperly grounded condensor will gvie you fits and you'll swear (and I mean that literally) that it is a fuel problem. In my younger days I have rebuilt perfectly good carbs and it ended up being the condensor. I have amazed people at the shop with this quick fix. sometimes it will even run smooth at all speed untill you put a load on the engine. Or, it could be a piece of dirt in the carb. Could have dislodged when you put on the new gasket. If that don't fix it, you ought just sell the darn thing to me, cheap since it won't run right. Fat chance, huh!!!
Hope the Easter Bunny is good to you all and you find something Federal Yellow in your basket.
Till next time ,
Rick

Just so we don't forget:
THINGS WE CAN LEARN FROM A DOG
Never pass up the opportunity to go for a joyride.
Allow the experience of fresh air and the wind in your face to be pure ecstasy.
When loved ones come home, always run to greet them.
When it's in your best interest, practice obedience.
Let others know when they've invaded your territory.
Take naps and stretch before rising.
Run, romp and play daily.
Eat with gusto and enthusiasm.
Be loyal.
Never pretend to be something you're not.
If what you want lies buried, dig until you find it.
When someone is having a bad day, be silent, sit close by and nuzzle them gently.
Thrive on attention and let people touch you.
Avoid biting when a simple growl will do. On hot days, drink lots of water and lay under a shady tree.
When you're happy, dance around and wag your entire body.
No matter how often you're scolded, don't buy into the guilt thing and pout...run right back and make friends.
Delight in the simple joy of a long walk.

Kenneth Updike - 09:28am Apr 14, 1998 EST (#118 of 800)
I was e-mailed about the existance of this site and will have to explore fully, later. I have the answers on the original paint color choices, (both the red & yellow)and development of the Cub Cadet from its conception to production. I will post this info in a few days. Also, I'm looking for list prices of IH built Cub Cadets for a forthcoming book I'm currently researching. Can anyone help????? Is there any one interested in a book on the Cub Cadet/Cub & Cub Lo-Boy tractor line??????? Here's some trivia to think about; Did IH build a 154 Cub Lo-Boy tractor with a HYDROSTATIC transmission??????...YES!!!!!!!

Stephen LaRoche - 07:28am Apr 15, 1998 EST (#124 of 800)
Bob Necker, here is a question for you. On my first Original Cub Cadet I restored I can't get it to low idle without it stalling out. I can get it slightly above a low idle if I choke it a little. Now the other day I noticed gas leaking out of the carburetor and it started filling up the oil breather. Well I changed the Fuel shut off valve (had a new spare). that seems to have solved that problem, but here is the puzzling part. I had changed the little nut and needle that goes inside the fuel bowl above the float. The old needle was very worn and shot. Do you think that the reason my gas overflowed into the oil breather was because the float isn't pushing the little needle all the way up and closing the fuel off? If this is the case, how do I know how far to bend the little tang on the metal float, trial or error? Should I just leave it alone, and don't worry about it(only happens when its parked in the shed and never happened before)? I tried to adjust one time the low idle with the idle screw but it didn't help. I can't figure out if this thing is getting too much fuel when I try to go to low idle or not enough(when I have to slightly choke it) when I am trying to get it to run at slightly above low idle. At max or slightly below max rpms it run fine. The choke cable and throttle cable look like they are installed correctly. My second original Cub Cadet runs fantastic! This one however is puzzling me. I think the answer is in the float adjustment. What do you think?, I just want to be able to run this thing at low idle without it stalling out. I suspect the float adjustment is the problem. Any ideas or suggestions? My first show is April 26th in East Hampton, Ct. I'll be bringing both Cub Cadets. I will send you a few pictures. Email me your address. The headlights look great on the picture you told another fellow to check out. I wish I could find a set. I wish I knew if they were actually an option. To the person looking for the rear tires for the Original Carlisle tires makes the 6x12 They are exactly like the original. Like a snow tire tread. Stephen in Connecticut

Mike Yacavone - 07:50am Apr 15, 1998 EST (#125 of 800)
Ken, I'll buy the book also. Please advise when available. Does anyone have info on availability of a Brinly lift and drawbar attachment for a 149 Cub three point hitch arrangement to work with a Brinly one bottom plow ? Thanks
Mike - Connecticut

Kenneth Updike - 08:31am Apr 15, 1998 EST (#126 of 800)
I would invite readers of this post to see our Cub Cadet site at www.mailbag.com/users/cngcoinc We have been a Cub Cadet dealer from the start of the Cub Cadet line and have a nice site with a lot of PRICED parts listed and more!!!!! I have "been there and done that" with a Cub Cadet (own a 782 and Spirit of 76, myself). We offer parts, service and new machine sales along with complete ground-up restorations. Check it out!!!!

Stephen LaRoche - 07:17am Apr 16, 1998 EST (#134 of 800)
Bob Necker, Well last night I took the fuel bowl off and checked my float. I pushed up the float level, then as high as it could go and it still didn't shut off the needle to the closed position. I said ok, thats the problem. I bent the little tang and reinstalled the float. checked to make sure that when the float went level, it closed off the fuel needle valve. Slapped it together and ran it. Adjusted the low idle and it runs pretty darn good. My second Cub Cadet runs a little better , but that engine had been overhauled a few years back. I am going to check into those head lights. I will check with my local dealer today. But they were an accessory for these back then? How do you know which terminal on the starter/generator to connect the hot wire to ? Also I took some pictures last night of both of the cub Cadets together. A spectacular sight!!! I checked the web site Ken Updike (www.mailbag.com/) said was for the Cub Cadets but I couldn't identify any Original Cub Cadet parts. I also would be interested in the Book people were talking about.

Kenneth Updike - 08:59am Apr 16, 1998 EST (#135 of 800)
Anyone on this forum interested in having decals made for the Spirit of 76 Cadets???? They are NLA from IH and Cub Cadet. I was able to acquire a copy of all the decal blueprints for these and would have some sets printed if others would buy them too. According to my production records from IH the number of Spirit of 76 Cadets built was 3,504 of these great lil Cadets. Which in 1975-1976 terms equates to about 1.2 units alloted per IH dealer. Not very many are out there!!!!!!

Kenneth Updike - 08:25am Apr 25, 1998 EST (#152 of 800)
As I had noted before, here's some IH Cub Cadet paint facts to ponder. The IH tractor committee report # 49 dated 9-29-1960 states the following on Cub Cadet paint;"Recommendation is made to the product Identification Committee that wheels, seat, grille screen and hood be painted Harvester White; the shifter knob,steering wheel, foot rests, and control buttons are to be black; balance of tractor is to be painted Federal Yellow with Harvester Red as optional....Implements will painted one solid color of Harvester White so that they can be use with tractors of either color combination" At the meeting being held on October 13,1960 tractors displaying BOTH color combinations will be displayed for committee review. Yes....IH Red was going to be an optional color right from the start, it only took nearly 30 years to get back to it in the 82 series. To find out more about Cub cadet colors and paint please see the May 1998 issue of RED POWER Magazine.

RON KELLER - 09:15am Apr 25, 1998 EST (#153 of 800)
KEN, THEN IN 1961 THERES A CHANCE THAT YOU COULD GET A CUB CADET IN RED. WOULD IT BE WRONG THEN TO PAINT ONE RED?

Kenneth Updike - 03:00pm Apr 25, 1998 EST (#154 of 800)
A post note to my Cub Cadet Paint posting. The report from IH also states;"The Divisional Product Committee is in agreement with this report, with the exception of Harvester Red as an optional color. We request that this option be eliminated and tractors be introduced with the color combination of yellow and white." So...unless your Cub Cadet is SN# 525 or BELOW, no you could not LEGALLY paint it IH red.

Bruce Palsgrove - 11:04am Apr 26, 1998 EST (#157 of 800)
I have a high-low gear box for a Cub that I would like to sell. It came with my 1200, since I am making a puller out of it, I don't need this gear box. The front bearing is out of it. I can fix this or sell "as is" (prefer as-is) I'll include the drive shaft also. Price? I haven't a clue what its worth, I sure could use the $$'s though. If someone can use it make me an offer. I have 2 sets of cast Cub wheel weights I would part with also. Not pretty looking but the came from a Cub stamped with IH on them if I recall. Gearbox could be shipped, weights don't think so :) I'm located in Eastern PA.

Tom Hoffman - 11:56am Apr 26, 1998 EST (#158 of 800)
Ken, On many serial # lists, including the one on this site, the starting serial # for the Cub Cadet is #590. I DO beleive that, in keeping with IH thinking that the start IS with #501. Why do you think that several lists come up with the #590 starting number. Could it be that that this is the number that first released to the public?? LATER TOM

Bob Necker - 06:30pm Apr 26, 1998 EST (#159 of 800)
Bruce, Creeper - Two speed rear , Hhhhmmmmm, well kinda but not really. The creeper gear is ahead of the transmission and has a planetary gear arrangement with input to the transmission, but since the transmission and the differential assemblies are in the same housing I guess it could be a two speed rear end. A shorter driveshaft is used and sheet metal with a slot for the actuating lever are necessary for proper installation. A factory option probably. Ken, I noticed in post #154 that you refer to serial number 525. Would the inference be correct that serial number 526 actually exists and that it is Federal yellow and IH white?
The serial number list on the web site http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cubcadet.htm is from "Hot Line Farm Equipment Guide's" 1997 Edition of "Quick Reference Guide", published by: Heartland Communications Group Inc. 1003 Central Ave PO Box 1052 Fort Dodge, IA 50501
Bruce, are those wheel weights for a Cub or Cub Cadet and how much do they weigh?

Kenneth Updike - 08:49am Apr 27, 1998 EST (#166 of 800)
In post #154 I reference Cub Cadets sn#525 and below. The question has been posed as to any Cub Cadets that exist with a serial # below #590. Yes I do believe they are still around. A number of these are in the Chicagoland and the Phoenix, AZ. areas. As for the serial number data, I personally use only genuine OEM (IH) production records and IH corporate letters and documents. I have found that sites which use data from the "red books or Blue books" have major data flaws in them. I refer to these "data books" as nothing more than "coloring books". As for the #590 Cub Cadet, I think this is the first Cub Cadet made at Louisville, Ky. IH factory. My point is this, in all my years of researching and acquiring IH records, alot of these so called "data books" or "reference guides" use and spread bad information. Personally, if I can't prove a machines existance with photos or records from IH, it never existed. I believe in IH facts not IH fiction.

Bob Necker - 12:18am Apr 28, 1998 EST (#169 of 800)
Ken: Thanks so much for your input into the forum. We do know that #590 is alive and well. Owned by a frequent contributor to this forum. If there is in fact a machine with a lower serial number I would certainly be interested seeing supporting documentation.
The data and information on http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cubcadet.htm is compiled from IH reference materials such as parts books, advertising, owners manuals, and other official publications. Your statement that ...sites which use data from the "red books or Blue books" have major data flaws in them... somehow seems to paint with a rather broad stroke. All information on this site is accurate to the best of my knowledge.
The serial number 590 is generally accepted as the starting number by IH and Cub Cadet dealers. Although the "red" and "blue" books are not official OEM publications I have found that the information they provide is generally provided by or obtained from the OEM. Other than a few minor discrepencies and typos, I have found the information provided therein to be generally accurate. May we infer from the information in post #166 that you have ... genuine OEM (IH) production records and IH corporate letters and documents... that support the supposition that pre serial number 590 machines exist?
It is exciting to think that maybe there are possibly 89 Cub Cadet Originals out there that preceded the first production tractor available to the general public.
If this documentation does exist Iwould love to see it.

Kenneth Updike - 08:25am Apr 28, 1998 EST (#170 of 800)
The IH tractor committee report #49A dated 1-3-61 tells where IH put the initial production run of 25 Cub Cadet tractors outfitted with both mowing decks and front mounted blades. These units were placed with commmercial/industrial users to rapidly have hours of use put on them. IH engineering wanted 25 hours of mowing and 25 hours of blading work to be done with each unit. I'll list a few of the units intial testing locations here for everyone. Serial #501 & 502 were sent to Miami, FL. #503 went to the Gator Bowl in Jacksonville, FL. #504 & #514 went to the Park Distric in Ft. Pierce, Fl. #505 went to Tifton, Ga. #506 went to the Parks Dept in Orlando, Fl. #507 went to Atlanta, Ga. #509 went to the McCoy Air Force Base in Pinecastle, Fl. After the field results were transmitted back to IH engineers, and the units were given a passing note by the engineering staff, a second trial batch of Cub Cadets were built. What happened to the first Cub Cadets???? Some were sold to IH executives, or the project engineers themselves. A number of the "pre production" units were sold by former IH dealers in the western Chicago-land area and are still in the area today. What does this mean??? That #590 is the first production Cub Cadet from Louisville, Ky. but 89 other Cub Cadets were hand built prior to that by IH engineering. Cub Cadet #590 may be accepted as the first Cub Cadet by some. The Louisville,Ky. IH production records show this as the first one built there, but it is by no means the first Cub Cadet. The serial number data we dealers recieve from Cub Cadet today still shows the original starting at #501.

Kenneth Updike - 03:31pm Apr 30, 1998 EST (#186 of 800)
The early hand built Cub Cadets (sn#501 to #589) were probably made at the Hinsdale, IL. IH Engineering Center. A few MAY have been built at Louisville, Ky. IH factory to test out the assembly line for production problems too. For those needing info on the IH Collectors club, they have online membership e-mail at: ihcclub@aol.com. Or for those who are "internet challenged" the mailing address is IH Collectors Membership Dept. 310 Busse Hwy. Suite 250 Park Ridge, IL. 60068-3251. Cost is $10 annually. They have chapters all over the USA, Canada, and Europe. EVERYONE with an interest in ANY IH product is welcome!!! IH built or offered hundreds of different items from sales literature, to tractors, to trucks, to refrigeration, and of course Cub Cadets!!!! Its not just a IH tractor club!!!! Alot of the members including myself, use and collect Cub Cadets.
If I have stirred things up for people on this Cub Cadet forum, GREAT!!! I'll use a Cub with a model 1000 front loader to really pour it on next time. Who knows what will turn up next on the IH Cub Cadets???

Tom Hoffman - 09:20pm Apr 30, 1998 EST (#187 of 800)
BOB,
Do you where a mask when you buy(?) these tractors? They don't go that cheap around here!
Anybody in the Northern Illinois area.....There is a auction this weekend at Buck Brothers (a John Deere dealer in Hampshire.IL.) that will have about 12 used Cub Cadets on the block.
A few weeks ago I asked the ? what would cause my 61' to not run smoothly at a high idle. It boiled down to a weak spark. A new set of points and a new condenser did the trick. Runs great now!
LATER TOM

Phil Goodwin - 09:51am May 1, 1998 EST (#191 of 800)
I thought this info might help some "new" owners of the "old" machines discussed in this forum. There are parts manuals and information available from: Cub Cadet Corporation, in Cleveland, Ohio. The following are the publication numbers and cost: Model 70-100 Owners Manual 1014393R8 $4.00. Parts Manual TC-113 $27.00. Chassis Manual GSS-1349 $5.00. Engine Manual GSS-1350 $3.50. Total cost me $42.50 with shipping and took 5 days to arrive. Comes with a nice light blue three ring binder with a Model 70 pictured on the front and holds the contents of the manuals (about 400 pages). The information contained features detailed schematics and locations of every part of the tractors, indicates what is and isn't available or manufactured anymore and well worth the cash. To speed up the shipping you can call the company @ 1-330-273-4550. Hope I have helped someone. Phil Goodwin Rochester, New York

Kenneth Updike - 09:02am May 2, 1998 EST (#198 of 800)
TOM, The early cub fuel line is held on with brass fittings and rubber sleeves. IH used this same type of connectors in the 806 and 1206 diesel tractor's fuel system. The part number for the rubber sleeve is 144526H1 and they costs a whopping 50 cents each. The fuel line is not flared!!

Rick Goodman - 04:38pm May 2, 1998 EST (#199 of 800)
Wow,
I leave you guys alone for a couple of weeks and look what you happens! I always miss out on the good stuff. Got a lot of field work done though. Also picked up a model 1000 with a super good 44" deck for $150.
The Original decal deal didn't work out but I found out about a lady that makes decals for old farm tractors.I am going to check this out and I'll keep you posted.
Sounds like South would be a good direction to go for vacation this year. Supposes the wife and kids would get mad if we stopped at every old farmhouse in Fla? If those things (pre-590) are out there, one will turn up sooner or later. Let's just all be glad we are able to own a few of the best old garden tractors built in the world.
I also wanted to say hi to the new names I saw on here. It's good to see all the interest in this growing hobby. Well, with all the rain we've had here the last few days, I'd better go. It's my turn to put my finger in the hole in the dike! Later, Rick

Dave Holtmart - 09:14pm May 2, 1998 EST (#200 of 800)
Hi guys this question is for Rick or Ken where is the serial number located on the first of the 7hp. cadets? Also the one I have the deck mounts on the front and has it's own 5hp. briggs engine it's 36inch cut 2 blade. I have no idea what brand it is or color it was (allrust finish now) if either of you has any info on it , I would like it if possible. The only thing I know is it was sold here locally and the dealer died several years ago, and the owner is gone to. Thanks Dave

David Cripps - 11:06pm May 2, 1998 EST (#201 of 800)
Where can I get the 7HP decal that goes on the gas tank of the originals also the dash decal? Thanks, David

Rick Goodman - 02:28am May 3, 1998 EST (#202 of 800)
Dave,
The serial # is stamped into the transmission housing on the right hand side of the tranny. I don't know what kind of deck you are referring to. As far as I know, all decks on the Originals were a belly mount. Anyone else know about anything aftermarket that mounts on the front?
David, as for the gas tank decals, I am pretty sure they are no longer available. However, I got an accessory parts book from a Kohler distributor and there are some decals with the HP. designations ( man, these big words are scaring me) and I have ordered a few to see if I can make them look as close to authentic as possible. I think they will work and as soon as I get them I'll let you all know. As for the dash decal, I have them in stock. Let me know if you need one.
I am in need of a decal set for a "Spirit of 76" lawn tractor. Anyone got a set for sale. Hopefully I'll be able to get a picture of my 76 on the page soon. It's a neat piece of work and my 8 year old daughter has already claimed it as "hers". Can't argue with that!!.
Anyone got any K161 or K181 engines or parts for them for sale? Let me know. Till next time, Rick

John Withouse - 09:26am May 4, 1998 EST (#207 of 800)
Scott, it may be possible to add the hydraulic implement lift to a non-hydraulic lift hydro, but it may not be as simple as just tapping the valve block. The charge pump relief valve (70 - 100 psi) is on the top of the valve block on non-hydraulic lift hydros, but it moves to the right side of the valve block on hydraulic lift equipped models. The implement lift relief valve (500 - 625 psi) goes in it's place on top of the valve block. My brother-in-law and I have been looking into this because he wants to try it on his 147. If he tries it, I'll post the results (good or bad) to this forum.

John Simpson - 09:55am May 4, 1998 EST (#208 of 800)
I have a 128 (fairly decent) and am trying tom persuade the owner of a clean 70 to sell it to me. Which one should I restore and which one should I build for pulling? What range should I consider paying for a clean model 70?

Stephen LaRoche - 10:42am May 4, 1998 EST (#209 of 800)
David C. contact Brandon Pfeiffer for the 7HP decals. I got a few sets from him. They are identical to the originals. I think he charges $6.00 a pair. brandonp@evansville.net He is in Illinois Bob Necker: I live just off I-91 in Enfield Ct. At the border of Mass. My brother-in-law picked up the rear half of an Original Cub Cadet. I wonder if he would want to sell it. I will have to ask. But your leaving tomorrow and I know I wouldn't get back to you in time. Oh well. Have a great trip. NH is beautiful.

Tom Hoffman - 08:09pm May 7, 1998 EST (#224 of 800)
Steve at #218. Go to Yahoo and type in rfhoutz that will take you to R.F. Houtz ans Son's site. He is located in northern Illinois. LATER TOM

Harry Bursell - 11:29pm May 8, 1998 EST (#234 of 800)
Bob just got through all the posted messages. Didn't realize you were close to CT. What did you pick up in NH? If you get this in time and want to go a few hours out of your way I'm just off I-84 between Waterbury and Danbury CT. I've got a 124, 169 and 86 under my deck, all basket cases. Hope to get to them sometime. I use a 1450 all the time. I've restored a 122, 124, 126 and 129. Sold them after I finished each as they almost broke me to complete. Generally cost $400-500 for a decent machine but the parts can kill. Muffler at $20, tires at $40 or better, engine rebuild $300, thro-out bearing $26. By the time you're done its $1500 but what beautiful machines especially in the right colors. Although original paint in this area is $20 qt and $9 for a rattle can. Someone earlier mentioned prices half of these. Wish I new where that was. Also came across some NOS parts from a dealer that closed. Don't know what some of them are but many have IH part no.s. Also just finished going over an 1872 Super I'm trying to sell now. Has 740 hours and 60in deck. Wondered if anyone was familiar with this deck (model 190-374-100) as it is quite square cut and welded rather than the usual stamped steel type on most decks. What I wondered was if this was an old style IH original deck that MTD reused?? Weighs a ton. Thought it may have been originally from a Cub Low Boy or something else. The reason I ask is that when I bought new belts, the deck belt still uses and is marked with an IH part no. while the power take-off is marked CCC. Anyone know? Anyway Bob, e-mail me at IHCUBCADET@aol.com, or call me at 203-266-9258 I'll be home Sat. and Sun. Anyone else can call if you like to chat about cubs, need a part.

Harry Bursell - 11:20pm May 9, 1998 EST (#241 of 800)
Hope I'm not sending to many of these. Forgot to mention I came across a guy at a flea market that has Cub Cadet seats, vinyl with pad (without the metal pans). They apparently are factory seconds. They are the newer high back type (14in when you measure straight vertical line). They have the "Cub Cadet" logo molded in and he gets $25 each. I put one on mine, took a while to get it pulled around good but sure looks great and it's better than the $100 total new seat. I could try and get some if anyones interested. Post a reply here or e-mail me at IHCUBCADET@aol.com.

Harry Bursell - 10:12am May 10, 1998 EST (#246 of 800)
Note to all show guys and restorers of 71, 102, 122 and 123 units. I've got a mint condition original "Operator's Manual". Has the orange heavy paper cover. On the back is part no. 1 082 592 R3 with 8-4-67-14B. I make this as a revision 3 published in 1967. I'd be open to a reasonable offer.

Harry Bursell - 10:24am May 10, 1998 EST (#247 of 800)
Brad @ #3 - I didn't see anyone suggest pricing for your 149. My guess is $6-700 on the low side if it is rough to as much as $18-2400 if its great. I sold a 129 last December for $2500. I painted it and did some of the usual things (steering box cam follower, new seat, good tires, wheel bearings), but it was hardly used and in great shape when I got it. Had 42in deck and 42in blower. Hope this helps. Hey, you can still get service manuals from Cub. Don't have the number here but it's an 800. You can call 800 info for Cub Cadet in Cleveland.

Harry Bursell - 10:31am May 10, 1998 EST (#248 of 800)
Kevin @ 18 - I sold a creeper and drive shaft last year for $150. Then sold a 124 rear with creeper for $250. There's a guy in the area advertising a creeper now for $250. Hey, I've got the Cub installation instructions booklet for installing creeper in 86, 108, 128. Its 4 or 5 pages I could copy and mail if you need it. I think the creepers install mostly all the same but it was easier on the 86-128 models because there is a removable frame cover in front of the seat. Hope this helps. Let me know.

Harry Bursell - 10:44am May 10, 1998 EST (#249 of 800)
Message to Bob Necker - I don't have a CASE/IH dealer in my area. Do you or some one know a dealer that would ship the paint to CT. My cub dealers get double the CASE/IH prices. I usually use 6-8 rattle cans and 2 qts when I do a machine.

Tom Hoffman - 11:01am May 10, 1998 EST (#250 of 800)
Harry @ 249. Do you have a CASE/IH "Construction Equipment" dealer near you? They can get it for you! LATER TOM

Harry Bursell - 11:04am May 10, 1998 EST (#251 of 800)
Rick Goodman @#81 - I've been using Valvoline Universal Tractor Fluid. It lists all the fluid compliance types including IH Hy-Tran B6 as well as many others. I get it for $7 gal. at the NAPA store. From the Cub dealer its $3.50 Qt. I do use the Cub filters but they are $9ea. This seems high. I also noted the Operators manual for 122 notes using the Hy-tran OR SAE30 oil for manual shift units. What do you think.

Mike Wheat - 01:57pm May 10, 1998 EST (#252 of 800)
Harry @ 251...I've used Valvoline 30 wt oil in my motors(10-40 in winter) and rearends for years...this includes our pulling tractor. Never have had any problems. Most of the guys I know do the same. As you said, it is the manual. Mike

John Simpson - 02:48pm May 10, 1998 EST (#253 of 800)
I use Amsoil Series 20-50 Racing Oil in my Harleys and lawn equipment, Series 3000 5-30 in my Cummins Diesel, and Series 2000 0-30 in everything else. Nothing comes close to the service I get from these products. I also use Amsoil synthetic grease and synthetic transmission fluid.

Harry Bursell - 03:28pm May 10, 1998 EST (#254 of 800)
Tom @250 - I don't know of a CASE/IH Dealer, Farm or Construction Equipment. I checked the phone books for Danbury, Waterbury and New Haven CT and found nothing. This area is a little strange that way. Possibly there is one in NY or MASS. Anybody know??

Anton Rothbauer - 07:06pm May 10, 1998 EST (#257 of 800)
Anyone know of source for Original 4.80/4.00/8 front tires. I need three sets and would also consider very good used ones. Indiana anton@otherside.com

Harry Bursell - 08:57pm May 10, 1998 EST (#258 of 800)
Bob Necker and others - your old iron web site notes cubs built until 1979 by IHC. I came across one of those catalogs like the Web page for Parts and Accessories. It's titled "International Power Lawn Products Parts and Accessories '80" (meaning 1980). There is a red Cub 382 on the cover and includes same type of items as the 75 catalog on the web page. Did IH build Cubs in 1980, the red ones? One of the dealers told me the IH implement dealers got red Cubs and the Lawn equipment dealers got yellow and white. Heard this before?

Mike Wheat - 09:38pm May 10, 1998 EST (#259 of 800)
Harry...yes I use the 30 wt Valvoline in the rearends, both in my tractor(Cub 100)that has done the chores for the last 14 years and my son's pulling tractor. I don't know too much about the newer ones, but I'll call a dealer friend and get his input too...Mike

Scott McKenzie - 10:19pm May 10, 1998 EST (#260 of 800)
Harry @ 249, for what it's worth I seemed to remember that there was a Case/IH Dealership in Southington, CT, right up the street. My father has a Case Internation 244 and I think that is where he goes for parts. If you can't find it e-mail me and I'll ask him the name of it and if he's been there lately (mckenzie@notes.nu.com).

Stephen LaRoche - 02:57am May 11, 1998 EST (#261 of 800)
Anton Rothbauer, for original tires for the front I believe I got a set form Danko. I will check tommorrow. They are exactly like the originals. Try a truck/farm tractor tire business and they should be able to order them for you. They will have a book with the tread paterns in it to look at. For the rear tires if you want them to look like the Original for the lawn type that look like snow tires then Carlisle makes these 6x12's.

Dave Holtmart - 06:33am May 11, 1998 EST (#262 of 800)
Harry, At #249 If you haven't found a cub dealer, I use this one Lucas of Cortland here in central N.Y. they are one of the Largest in N.Y. . They carry all of the cub paint and a large line of parts as well. If you want give them a call and ask for Brad or Steve in parts both know their parts. Their phone # is area code 607- 756- 2863 tell them I sent you they know me well. Also as far as hydro oil pennzoil makes a good oil I use it most of the time, for the hydro filter I use fram # ph 2844 if any of you have newer engines with oil filters on them I use fram # ph 3614, you can get them at Wal- mart for les than 3$. Both of these are direct cross over from oem part numbers, and I use them all of the time in my repair business.

Harry Bursell - 07:28am May 11, 1998 EST (#263 of 800)
Dave @262 - thanks for the info on the oil, filters and the dealer. What is your repair business?

Harry Bursell - 12:13am May 12, 1998 EST (#272 of 800)
Mason @271 - it's hard to say where to start. I'm really a novice myself. I've gone completely through a 1/2 dozen and worked on several others. You didn't mention a mowing deck or other accessories. What do you want to do with it. As information, Cub models indicate hp and trans, in your case, the 10 in Model 107 is the 10hp and the 7 as an odd number indicates hydro. The 10hp motor was a Kohler model K241. Your 8hp should be K161 and the 12hp is a K301 assuming these are the all cast iron K series. I think they were really the best (the newer ones have aluminum cases and some cast iron sleves). If your 8hp runs good you could put it in but I don't know how well it would work. I believe the smallest Cub put in hydros was the 10hp. It probably will work OK especially if you have a small mowing deck (36-38in). As for the wiring you mention, my experience on several model 126 and 127 units is that the wiring harnesses may had a quality problem or something else. Most of mine have had internal breaks in one or two of the wires from the dask to the voltage regulator. Probably best to get a new harness, but would guess it at $50. You could make one if you're into that, with some good quality 10gauge wire. I believe the operators manual has the wiring diagram and schematic although it may only be in the service manual. your probably also have a problem with the hood pin connection points to the grill. Hope you are a good mig welder or know some-one. I think the weakest point in all the older Cubs is the steering but it's rebuildable. If you have more than about 1-2" play in the steering wheel it probably needs atleast adjusting. Recommend getting the service manual and follow instructions. Most I've seen have 5-6"play but lots of people don't care. Keeps your hands moving if you're trying to mow in a straight line. Some of the play could also be at the tie rod and drag link joints and the wheel spindles. All you can do is check and probably replace. If your front axle has back and forth play where the pin holds it to the frame you probably have to remove and tighten the frame mount area together. I usually do this with a 5/8" nut and bolt, you actually squeeze it until the axle will just slip in. I also replace the pin. Hope all this doesn't discourage you. Cubs are really great machines, you can always get the parts you need and fix'm, and as you do you really learn and know your machine. It seems most people these days want something cheap that they don't have to do maintenance on, just use it and throw it away in a couple years. As they do, we just keep on using our Cubs, over and over and over. Hope this helps Harry

Stephen LaRoche - 07:29am May 12, 1998 EST (#276 of 800)
Anton, Correction on the front tires, they are DICO turf guide tires 480/8 You should be able to get them.Email me if you need the tel. # for the place I got mine if your dealer is having a hard time finding them. Check with a farm or truck tire business.
Nice talking to you last night Ron Keller. I made the copies this morning for you. Be sending them out soon.

John Simpson - 09:27am May 12, 1998 EST (#278 of 800)
Harry; if you're going to rewire, I suggest you use marine grade wire. Ithas smaller stands, more of them, is more flexible, a better covering, and stands more abuse. Also, solder all connectors, even if you use crimp connectors. That prevents corrosion at the connector/wire joint. -John

Harry Bursell - 11:55am May 12, 1998 EST (#279 of 800)
Mason @273 - mowing deck usually has a model no. tag, which you need for belts, parts, etc. The size of the deck is usually the 1st two no.s If you measure the deck be sure to measure from outside blade edge to outside blade edge. Some people have measured the overall deck width and mistakenly call their deck 50" when it actually is a 42.
John @278 - thanks for the tip on marine wire. Where would you usually find it? I don't recall seeing it at hardware store or Home Depot. Thanks Harry

Harry Bursell - 11:23pm May 12, 1998 EST (#288 of 800)
Joe Cardani @282 - If you don't have the original one to start with I got 4 old units that need re-building. They're from 8 & 12hp motors but I think these AC-Delco units were really all the same. Don't know where you are but expect it could be shipped. Last I checked aroung CT 2 years ago new ones weren't available, just re-built at $3-400 bucks without exchange, or rebuilding yours for $75-150. Also, you didn't mention if you had the mounting bracket. I've got one from an 8hp (model 86)which is probably the same. Reply on the forum or for more details you can e-mail me at IHCubCadet@aol.com

Aaron Gonya - 02:04am May 13, 1998 EST (#290 of 800)
Would a regular AC-Delco generator work? (I work in an auto parts store ) and can get them for a lot less money I think a generator will turn into a motor when current is applied Anyone have any Ideas?

Dave Holtmart - 06:33am May 13, 1998 EST (#292 of 800)
Aaron at # 290, a starter- generator for a car turns a kholer backwards and won't work, been there and tried it ! If you can find a rebuilder near you they could rebuild one for you if you have a core. If you have a core check the rear cover to see if you have the large center or small, the difference is large has a bearing and small has bushing you want the bearing lasts longer, and takes less power to turn it. Dave

Harry Bursell - 11:38pm May 13, 1998 EST (#303 of 800)
Hey guys - thought I saw an earlier message where someone was looking for a snow thrower for a 1650. Guess I'm going to have to print all the forum pages for easier reference and review. Anyway, wish I was close to Cameron, Wisconsin because Kohel Implement, phone 715-234-4240, is advertising a snow thrower off a 1450 for $99. It's also listed at the end of his used equipment list at www.kohelimp.com (but be careful because he's a JD dealer) I looked for 3 years in CT before I found one and I'm still not sure if it is the right one (Its a QA42A). (After I got mine I came across 3 more, seems they come and go) It works great and attaches right but the thrower shute is very close to the tip end of my hood.

David Kirk - 12:08am May 15, 1998 EST (#321 of 800)
Some notes on Delco starter-generators. The early units had ball bearings on both sides of the armature, and external oil cups for lubrication. Later models eliminated the oil cups and used sealed ball bearings. After about 1970, a third version utilized a bronze bushing on the commutator end. An internal oil wick lubricates this bushing, but eventually this dries out and the bearing fails. If caught in time, more oil can be introduced into the wick by removing the end cover and observing the obvious. The best starter-generator is the second version with 2 sealed ball bearings.
Some earlier questions concerned reversing these units, as they were made in CW or CCW rotational versions, depending on the application These units can quite simply be reversed by swapping the brush leads relative to the field poles. Other trivia: A starter-generator is both a series and shunt wound machine, the series current flow path is used for motoring while the shunt path is for generating. The armature windings are heavier than an equivalent 12V Delco automotive generator. Thus the starter-generator is a compromised device - it does neither job very well but is sufficient for our one-lung Kohlers with automatic compression releases. I have had good success rebuilding starter-generators. Brushes and bearings are still available, and if the insulation on the windings appears un-burned, usually resurfacing the commutator and new brushes will restore full performance.
Hope some of this rambling proves helpful.

John Withouse - 08:55am May 15, 1998 EST (#325 of 800)
Gotta throw my 2 cents in on the oil/filters: If you follow the lube specs recommended by the manufacturer, you should be fine. Hy-Tran is an excellent hydraulic fluid. We use it in all our Cub Cadets, partly because we use it in our farm tractors and usually have it on hand in quantity. A Cub Cadet hydro holds 7 quarts, but a Farmall 706 holds 20+ gallons. I don't have much experience with other hydraulic fluids, but if they really meet Hy-Tran B6, they should be fine. Fram filters have always been good filters, and I wouldn't hesitate to use them, but we have better luck finding the right size at our Case/IH and CC dealer, so thats what we usually go with. I prefer Valvoline motor oil (I'm sure their hydraulic oil is good stuff, too.) My dad, who is a retired IH dealer service technician, uses Case/IH Low Ash in his 106 and 129 as well as his tractors. He uses Mobil in his car and pickup. There are several other good oils out there, too. But Pennzoil?!! Eewwww!

Harry Bursell - 02:08pm May 15, 1998 EST (#331 of 800)
Hey guys, just heard Harley Davidson put out message NOT to use SAE SJ oils. It is not designed for air cooled engines. I checked my Valvoline HPO SAE30 and sure enough its SJ. Any more oil comments??

John Simpson - 02:34pm May 15, 1998 EST (#332 of 800)
Harry Bursell: Harley is in the business of selling oil, parts, and service. They've been telling me for years that nothing but Harley oil will work in my Harleys. I've been ignoring them and using pure synthetic 20-50 racing oil, and never had a lubrication or cooling related repair needed.

John Withouse - 02:52pm May 15, 1998 EST (#333 of 800)
Jared@#326, that's the type of rear PTO I was referring to in #309. I think they're few and far between. John S. - I agree, synthetics are great. It would be interesting to know, though, what the real difference is between hydraulic fluids. Hy-Tran and other hydraulic fluids operate regularly under greater stress in bigger machines without problems. My point is: Will the difference have a noticeable effect on reliability, wear, etc. in a Cub Cadet under normal service (pullers, etc. excluded?) I'm guessing not the kind of difference you'd see using synthetic vs. standard oil in severe service applications. I think keeping both engine oil and hydraulic fluid clean and free of moisture is more important than the brand name, but as I mentioned before, I do have my brand loyalties.

John Simpson - 03:25pm May 15, 1998 EST (#334 of 800)
John Withouse (333) You hit the nail on the head on service habits. The differences in oils diminish graetly with more frequent oil and filter changes. But since we do run high temperature engines, the virtues of synthetic oils, i.e. high shear strength, viscosity stability with regard to temperature, and high boil-points (virtually no evaporative losses or sludging), make them more critical for your Cub Cadet than for your car (unless you have a VW or a Porsche)!

David Kirk - 08:11pm May 15, 1998 EST (#337 of 800)
Harry (#322) and John (#323), thank you for your comments. I'm glad info was useful to you.
Wow, what an oil controversy! Here is my experience over the years in working on small, air-cooled engines. Owners that use a name-brand oil, change it regularly, and follow the engine manufacturer's recommendations on viscosity, will get maximum life from their engine. The cast iron K-series Kohler engines used in the older Cubs can actually achieve 2000 hours durability in service, if well cared for. If you really want to give your engine a treat, change the oil every 20 hours instead of the recommended 30 hour interval. Stay away from "special" oils or oil additives - there useless and a waste of money. Kohler recommends straight 30 weight for summer operation as the heavier viscosity reduces oil consumption (past the piston rings) and thus carbon deposits in the combustion chamber. Synthetics are of lighter viscosity but are more thermally stable, and thus may be more viscous at operating temperature. I will call some friends in the engineering division at Kohler and get their opinion on running synthetics, then pass it on to you gentlemen.
Carbon accumulation in the combustion chamber is usually what causes the eventual failure in the high-time Kohler. The deposits accumulate at the upper end of the cylinder bore, between the head and top piston ring travel area. The deposits are so hard that the top piston ring land wears severely or actually breaks off. Naturally, this allows for compression leakage, loss of power, and high oil consumption. Kohler recommends removing the head every 500 hours and decarboning - a definate must! It is also a good idea to check and re-torque head bolts every 100 hours, as well as cleaning chaf out of the cooling fins. Running unleaded gasoline also keeps chamber deposits to a minimum.
I hope someone, someday, writes a beautifully illustrated book on the history of the International Cub Cadet. I'll be the first to buy a copy!

Mike Wheat - 09:41pm May 15, 1998 EST (#339 of 800)
Hey Guys! Question: where is the IH refinery?? or is it made by XXX?? I agree with Dave @337, he has stated it well. The only thing I would like to add is there is a difference in bases. As I understand it, there are parafin based (Penzoil,Valvoline,Kendall) and there are crude oil based (Havoline) oils. I was told it is not a good idea to mix them. The parafin based, if run too long, will actually coat the inside of your motor with wax...saw it myself in a friend's 350 motor. The crude base turns into that terrible black sludge. As far as loyalty...if my $100's of dollars worth of parts are outweighed by a couple of quarts of oil...sorry, I'll still buy Valvoline. I have the choice of probably 6 IH dealers in the area and I am LOYAL to the guys I started with. I don't price shop between them and I don't buy aftermarket parts..right down to the air filter...Mike

David Kirk - 11:42pm May 15, 1998 EST (#341 of 800)
Harry (#340), you can do it - it's a piece of cake! Remove cooling baffle, remove head bolts, and pull head. Scrape piston dome with a soft, plastic or wood scraper. An old plastic windshield ice scraper works great. Also, a wire brush works well for around and over the valves. Scrape the underside of the head in the same manner. I have access to a glass bead blaster, and this works wonders for the head - makes it look like a new casting! Be sure to clean thoroughly after doing this, especially in spark plug threads. The top of the bore is where the carbon ring builds up that damages the piston. This carbon is usually rock hard and I've found that a utility knife (or pocket knife) blade works best here. Roll the piston down to bottom center and scrape the top area of bore carefully to remove the carbon ring. Then blow clean with compressed air.
Now, if you're a real purist, take a sheet of 120 grit emery paper on a flat surface (like a steel plate) and resurface the head (rub it back and forth over the stationary emery paper-apply even pressure). I'm always amazed at how every head is so grossly warped. This technique gives a nice flat surface that keeps the head gasket from blowing. Finish by using 220 grit paper. Clean thoroughly, and your ready for reassembly. If the head gasket looks good, re-use it. Its a metal clad gasket and may be reused if not torched by a previous leak - caused by improperly torqued head bolts. Clean the threads on the head bolts and apply some oil to them - this lowers friction and gives more accuracy to torque values. Clean everything, put on gasket, put on head, insert bolts and torque to values given in the service manual. Be sure to use the correct sequence in torquing the bolts - also shown in manual.
A cylinder hone is used after boring or reconditioning a glazed bore. Hone is not needed for a decarbonization job. Valve clearances always become smaller due to valve seat recession and valve stretch. I check the clearances on my K301 every year - its so easy to do.
I thought I was the only guy in the world that was an IH Cub Cadet fanatic until I discovered this great page. But could one of you Cub experts please tell me when my 1250 was made? The s/n is 555960. Was it '75 or '76 ????? Thanks.

Kenneth Updike - 09:06am May 16, 1998 EST (#344 of 800)
FYI....The Lo-Ash engine oil is made by Viscosity Oil Co of Chicago, IL. This was IH's exclusive oil supplier until the merger/split-up.I believe IH even owned Viscosity Oil at one time. Viscosity's base stocks are crude oil based, not parrafin too.
FYI...The Cub Cadet book is still in the works, I try to get a chapter done every two weeks. There is so much out there on these great machines, where do you stop writing on them???? Should the book mention the Cub Cadets built after the sale to MTD?????
BOB.....I think that your counter is probably spinning like a helicopter blade by now. I hope to add a few RPM's to it myself. Thanks for a great site!!!! Ken

Bob Necker - 11:58am May 17, 1998 EST (#354 of 800)
Oh, it's raining and looks like a good day to be a cyber jockey. As for the inclusion of the MTD units in your upcoming book, Ken, it certainly is a vital part of Cub Cadet history and in my opinion the saddest. IH created the Cub Cadet as an integral part of it's line-up for the new suburban dweller's large lawn and it became an immediate hit with these owners and larger entities such as cemeteries and municipial and state agencies because of their durability, ease of maintainence and and parts availability from an established dealer network. Incidently, this network still exists. If you want parts for your IH Cub Cadet, your best bet is to check your local Case IH dealer. There are many Case IH dealers that are also Cub Cadet dealers so you will get the best of both worlds. Personal experience is that a 'new' Cub Cadet dealer will probably carry some other lawn/garden equipment lines and will not be of much assistance when attempting to get some obscure part for your 1961 Original. Try your Case IH dealer for best results, preferrably one that has been around for awhile.
When MTD purchased the division it became just "one more" albeit separate lawn/garden tractor in their extensive line. As we all know they manufacture nearly 85% of the units sold today in this country.
This forum and it's parent site http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cubcadet.htm was created for the gathering and dissemination of information about International Cub Cadets manufactured by the International Harvester Company. Personally, I don't give "two whoops in Hell" about the units produced by MTD, but do acknowledge the lineage. For Gawd's sake they make machines for K-Mart, Ace Hardware, and even some of the lower-end green and yellow units.
The tractors, and I mean tractors, designed and manufactured by IH are a far cry from the plastic and light sheet metal units being produced today. How many of them do you think will be around 37 years from now? Still at work and doing a great job of mowing and tilling and other workhorse kinds of chores. Besides being such darn nice looking tractors. Real metal and tough running gear to boot. Gel-coat and polyeurethane can never replace cast iron and good honest-to-God sheet metal. Try to get replacement parts for these units in a few years. Does anybody have an oil bath air cleaner bowl and wire retainer for an Original they would like to part with? I need one. Also need an oil pan for 12 HP K-131 Kohler. (Rick, you still around ! ?)
Yikes - I better get off this soapbox before Tom gets after me ! ! Just kidding. After all it is my creation.
Have fun guys. And if you can help me out with those parts. I would appreciate. By the way is anybody interested in proper die cut decals for the Originals or Tee shirts? If enough are, I am working a deal on both. What would you like to see on the shirts? My present thoughts are for a nice graphic of an Original in three colors.
'Nuff said, Bob

Harry Bursell - 02:43pm May 17, 1998 EST (#355 of 800)
Bob @354 - love to have a T-shirt, suggest it also have a really biiiiiig IH emblem. What about ball caps too? Had a red hat with black/white IH emblem a few years ago. Gave it to a friend with a IH Farmall 350. Never seen Cub Cadet hat. As for the MTD comment, I was wondering myself and didn't realize they made 85% of all. Also interesting to note that based on the serial no.s on the forum parent site it appears IH made about 643,000 in just under 20 years. Note from Ken earlier mentioned the one millionth Cub would be built this year. Looks like MTD hasn't been able to build as many as IH in about the same amount of time. Based on the new MTD 2000 and 3000 I think their sales will probably decline further (don't know year to year no.s). The new ones just don't look like tractors. Hope they keep it going, we need the parts. Harry

David Kirk - 07:07pm May 17, 1998 EST (#359 of 800)
It was a beautiful day today in Wisconsin, made even nicer in that I got to spend 3 hours cutting grass on my 1250 Cub. The whine of the hydrostatic, the regular beat of the Kohler, the aroma of fresh cut grass mixed with the occasional whiff of exhaust fumes...man, what a delightful experience!
Bob Necker(#354), the artwork you propose for the tee shirt sounds perfect to me. Three colors would look great. You may be interested to know that a nice IH logo-decal is still available, part no. 27771R1. This is the decal that goes in the rear fender location, centered below the seat. Friends tell me that IH did make a Cub Cadet hat in the mid '60's. It would be nice to offer reissues of these too, if possible.
Harry (#355) and others, there are very nice hats available with IH INTERNATIONAL HARVESTER embroidered patches sewn on. They cost $7.00 and are available in several styles and colors. They are obtainable from: HOOVER PROMOTIONS R.R. 2, Box 286 Winamac, IN 46996 219-278-7277 Nice people to do business with and you'll be pleased with their products.

David Kirk - 07:29pm May 18, 1998 EST (#379 of 800)
I called a friend at Kohler Co., Engine Division, to get info on approved engine oils (namely synthetics) that can be used in K-series iron block engines. Kohler has done testing with Mobil-1 oil and has actually seen reduced oil consumption (in some cases) when compared to straight 30 weight mineral oil. There is evidence that less carbon deposits form in the combustion chamber area when using synthetic oil, a definite benefit. The data is inconclusive as to extended life of the engine when using synthetics. High-time engines may weep oil around the crankshaft seals or gasketed joints, and this should be checked out if switching to synthetics.
I also learned that typical oil temps for K-series engines running full load on a hot day are around 250-275 deg F, where the new all-aluminum engines can see 300+ deg F. This was surprising, as I always thought the iron block would be the hottest. Thus, synthetic oil would benefit the aluminum engine more due to it's stability at high temps.
The conclusion - synthetic oil will not be harmful to the cast iron Kohler, and is probably a superior lubricant for this engine over straight 30 wt mineral oil. I would personally keep the change interval at 30 hours max.

David Kirk - 12:39am May 20, 1998 EST (#397 of 800)
Harry (#384), thanks for the support. I also use a conventional 30 wt. name brand oil in my K301 and change at 20 - 25 hour intervals. As to your question on old scrap blocks lying around: unfortunately for us, Kohler melts down all it's scrap iron blocks and thus none are to be had. Probably make bathtubs out of them. As to your K321 using 1oz oil every 2 hours, this is perfectly normal, and quite good for an engine with that high time.
When my engine was "freshened up" a couple of years ago (new std.piston, rings, con rod, and cylinder honed) it continued to use oil just about at the same rate as before the rebuild. Nothing serious, no blue smoke in the exhaust, but oil level noticeably down after about 5 hours running. After much searching, probing, and contemplating, I finally found the culprit...it was the DIP STICK! It seems that my original part, thru years of vibration, had wallowed out the o-ring sealing disc that the stick passes thru, allowing a large air leak into the crankcase. This was confirmed when I stuck my finger down in the dip stick tube and pulled out black oily swill that was being deposited there. A single cylinder 4-stroke has check valves in the crankcase (usually in the valve spring cavity) such that air is allowed to exit the case on the piston down stroke, and a vacuum is formed on the up stroke. This "breather" system thus maintains an average, partial vacuum in the crankcase which greatly assists in keeping oil from migrating past the piston rings and ultimately into the combustion chamber. My leaky stick allowed no vacuum to be established and thus oil was lost past rings. A new replacement dip stick solved the problem and now the engine uses hardly any oil between changes. The new part had been improved with a large rubber grommet replacing the original metallic disc and o-ring.
Moral of story - Leaking seals, gaskets, and even dip sticks can cause the Kohler engine to use oil. Check these things out before you rebuild - could save you time and money.

Kenneth Updike - 06:52pm May 21, 1998 EST (#409 of 800)
Harry....#407...The truck "glider" kit is made of the truck frame, front axle and cab. The engine, trans and rear ends are all to be use from a "donor" truck (usally wrecked). See www.NAVISTAR.com or www.KENWORTH.com for more info. The 1100 I list has everything except the engine in it.(had one of those Chief Wahoo engines in it...NOT original!!!!) It's a good Cub Cadet repower unit or its restorable, but its NOT a good puller unit. It has the cheap Peerless style rearend in it.(like a 76 Cadet) The 1100 looks like the 1250-1650's. But it did not have the side engine enclosure panels like the other models of the "Quiet Line" did....FYI.....Those side engine panels are NLA and can very valuable!!!!!!
The Super Garden tractor series actually was started by IH with the Red 982 Cub Cadet. These were like Garden tractors on steroids,just plain bulkier, and heavier made. Not much has changed in its design until lately, when it too was MTD'd. The 982's were OK, except for the ONAN engine, we had trouble with them.

David Kirk - 08:39pm May 21, 1998 EST (#410 of 800)
Harry (#384), here is what I personally use as a guide in judging whether a Kohler engine is in need of a rebuild: does it blow blue smoke from the exhaust or breather, does it knock or rattle, does it use excessive amounts of oil, is there metal particles in the oil, and finally does it have a serious lack of power. You've already stated that oil consumption is nill, and if the other awful things I just mentioned aren't happening, then your engine is probably fine.
Dave Holtmart made an excellent suggestion about checking compression pressure before pulling the head. This is not easy to do on the Kohler however, as the engine has ACR (automatic compression release) which gives false (low) readings when testing with a conventional compression gauge. Kohler states in the manual to rotate the engine backwards rapidly to obtain correct compression pressure readings, but I've never been able to figure out how to do this easily. What I use is a DIFFERENTIAL COMPRESSION GAUGE. With this instrument the engine does not need to be rotated. It is a static measurement to see how much pressurized air leaks past rings and valves. There is not enough space here and I'm too poor a writer to explain how this gauge works and how to use it, but I'm sure that a mechanic friend would have one and would help you. Be sure the head bolts are torqued properly before making this test, otherwise you'll get false readings due to head gasket leakage.
Incidently, Kohler furnishes .010 undersize "service" connecting rods for these engines, and it is therefore permitted to regrind crankpin to .010 undersize. Hope this proves helpful.

John Withouse - 04:48pm May 26, 1998 EST (#459 of 800)
Well, I haven't had any bites on the '62 original I offered for sale or trade in #406. Guess that means you all think I should keep it and restore it. Maybe you're right, but I'm still keeping an open mind

John Withouse - 08:55am May 27, 1998 EST (#466 of 800)
John S. at #460, I bought my '62 without an engine. The "originals" were all built with 7hp K141 Kohler engines, so it sounds like yours has the right engine. As far as the tractors, they didn't really carry a model number. I suppose that's because there was only one model. All the hood decals said was "International Cub Cadet". They started using model numbers with the 7hp model 70 and 10hp model 100 in 1963. Bob's web page has some excellent pictures of originals, 70's, and 100's. You mentioned earlier that yours had a 42" deck with cast ends - that may be a slightly newer deck than the tractor. My '62 has the 38" 2 spindle deck with Gilmer belt for spindle timing (no offset.) This was the first deck offered with the originals. The type you describe was sold with 70's, 100's, etc., but may have been available earlier. Does anyone out there know if the "cast end" decks were offered with the originals?

john a smith - 02:13am May 29, 1998 EST (#493 of 891)
hello everybody .Im new to this site but i really enjoy it ! I sell new old stock parts for gas engines including Clinton ,Kohler,Tecumseh,Onan,Lauson,Reo,Briggs,Wisconsin,i also sell motors used complete and will part out also dont have any big kohler motors right now but i do have a couple of twin cyl. kohlers that ill part out if anyone needs parts .I also have a friend here in my same town that collects Cubs hes got over 25 of them hes made them into mac trucks road graders double framed them so there twice as long hes put twin rear axles under them ,hes got alot of neat stuff .he wont ship anything as far as attacthments but hell some stuff let me know what your looking for and ill ask him if hes got an extra to sell . otherwise i do come into some stuff quite often like right now I have a Brinley garden plow and maybe a Disc for sale about 50$ a piece and i now of a good snowblade for 125$ for a late seventies tractor .i collect two tractors and threir implements and i sell them too whenever i run out of room.let me know if you need anything like carbs for Kohler motors i know i have some good Carter carbs for the smaller motors 6 to 8 hp. and a few bigger carbs as well I also have some new carb lower ends for guys whose are dented or rusted through . This is just my hobby so im reasonable price wise .talk to you later John Smith jksmith@dave-world.net

anton rothbauer - 05:38am May 29, 1998 EST (#494 of 891)

John Withouse - 12:00pm May 28, 1998 EST (#482 of 800)
John S., the headlights for a 100 are mounted in the upper grill opening. The picture on Bob's web page shows one with headlights (click on the blue hypertext link that says "Cub Cadet 100" just under the heading "Serial Numbers and Letters".) These pictures look like they're from original IH literature, so they should be about as accurate as you can get. On the subject of swapping engines (16 in front of a manual trans), I would think it should be OK. The pullers modify their clutches, but they're typically running much more than the stock 16hp. Another good indication is the fact that IH did build such a combination, the 582 (not the 582 Special.) It had the familiar 3 speed "Cub" trans and rear end behind a 16hp B&S twin cylinder. I don't think it had any special clutch pieces. I know my 782 (17hp twin Kohler w/hydro) has the same type of drive components as the older, lower hp hydros. What do the rest of you guys think?

Jesse Luebke - 10:15am May 31, 1998 EST (#514 of 800)
Hello again. Regarding David Kirk's post @321 on cw/ccw starter/generator rotation, I need help with what to change. I had mine rebuilt yesterday and it is now running in reverse. I took the end cap off of it and another one that I have, and I can't see any difference in the way they are hooked up. All of the wire leads and brushes look the same to me. The generator side was bad and they replaced the fields on the one I had rebuilt. Thanks.

David Kirk - 08:48pm May 31, 1998 EST (#517 of 800)
Harry (#509), I'm not sure if 1250 - 1650 drive shaft would retrofit into 149. After modifying the 149 shaft, I should have compared the two, but didn't. Sorry, I can't help here. Jesse (#514), I would suggest you take your starter/generator back to the rebuilder and have them fix it. If you are unable to do this, try unbolting the fields from the housing (the big Phillips head screws on outside) and swapping locations of the fields. Leave the wires attached to the appropriate brushes, don't change these. The leads should be long enough to allow swapping the field locations without taking them off the brush holders. If not, you may have to solder on extensions, but I don't think so. By the way, if everything is set up correctly, the armature rotates with the brushes "trailing" on the commutator (leaning in the direction of rotation). If they are "leading", then something is really wrong and the brushes will quickly wear out. I think the safe bet would be to let the shop fix their mistake, which they should do for free. Good luck and let us know how it works out.

Bob Necker - 09:06pm May 31, 1998 EST (#518 of 800)
Jesse: Take that starter/generator back and get your money back. Then take it to someone who knows what they are doing.

Dave Holtmart - 06:58am Jun 1, 1998 EST (#520 of 800)
Mason, NO a standard 12volt battery is all you need I like interstate heavy duty 355 amp. battery, they really spin a kohler over so they start quickly. Jesse take it back the rebuilder has put the wrong fields in it . Dave

John Withouse - 09:26am Jun 4, 1998 EST (#549 of 800)
Mike @ 540 and Brian @ 545: The 106's were built with 10hp Kohler K241 engines. The "10" in 106 stands for 10hp, and the "6" is a series number. The even numbers were manual trans models, and odds were hydrostatics. A 107 would be the same tractor, but with a hydrostatic transmission. Engines that would bolt in with no modifications include 8, 10, and 12hp K-series Kohlers. 14 and 16hp Kohlers will also bolt in, but the tractor frame has to be modified to allow the flywheel shroud to fit between the frame rails. Mike, you are correct in assuming the pedal is a combination clutch/brake. The first half of the pedal travel should disengage the clutch, the second half should apply the brakes. The K-series Kohlers have automatic compression releases to make them easier to start, that may be why it seems to have little compression. A complete replacement wiring harness is still available from CC (for about $60.) Price can depend on location, but around here (central Missouri), $350 - $400 sounds like the top bid (assuming the engine is OK.) $100 or less would be a steal, regardless of engine.

Robert Mull - 08:26pm Jun 6, 1998 EST (#566 of 890)
I need sugesstions on removing steering wheel on a model 105. thanks,robert mull

Mike Neuharth - 12:35am Jun 7, 1998 EST (#567 of 890)
Cub Cadet Fans Town and Country Tractor In Monroe Wa. Knows Old Cub's 360-794-5426 They Ship.

Tom Hoffman - 09:57am Jun 7, 1998 EST (#568 of 890)
Robert at #366, use the three jaw puller that the manual calls for!! You would think that it would come off easy from the size of the steering wheel, but don't let that fool you. If you bugger up the threads on the steering shaft you got big problems! LATER TOM
Hey Bob, Will you be able to post some photos of your trip on this page? (at least the PG rated ones)

Brian Severns - 12:42am Jun 8, 1998 EST (#569 of 890)
Robert @ 566, use lots of good penetrating oil on the wheel/shaft, let it soak overnight. This sometimes does the trick. I had one so stubborn that we ended up puting the nut back on to protect the threads, placed a small piece of round stock over the end of the shaft & nut, then while someone pulled up on the wheel, we used an air chisel to drive on the end of the round stock. After a few bursts with the chisel it popped right off. Does anyone have a nice plastic wheel for a cub 102 or 122, mine is severly weathered and cracked, case dealer got me a replacement wheel but it's deep dished, not flat like the original. Any suggestions on where to get a replacement? Got another cub today, that makes an even number of ten. Just hve to keep them all separated so the wife can't count them up.:-)
Seeya Brian

Dave Holtmart - 06:27am Jun 8, 1998 EST (#570 of 890)
Robert Mull, Here is another way for you if you don't have a 3 jaw puller. Go to your local hardware store and buy 5/8 fine thread bolt about 3 to 4 inches long with a nut, remove steering wheel nut and place new nut on covering about half of the threads on steering shaft, screw the bolt down inside the nut so it's tight, sit on the tractor seat with a hammer, place your knees under the outer part of the wheel and push up against the wheel and hit the head of the bolt squarely, may take a few blows to get the wheel to move. Don't place the new nut tight against the wheel leave a little room (afew threads 2to3 ). This is how i remove steering wheels as i don't have 3 jaw puller that will work, have removed several this way even old rusty ones. Dave

Bob Necker - 10:16pm Jun 8, 1998 EST (#572 of 800)
Dave Peterson you may get a box blade from Northern Hydraulics. They have one for Category 0 and 1 applications. They also have several attachments for the sleeve hitch adaptations. So does Sears. They are a bit lighter but will work.
By the way Connecticut Yankee Tractor of Waterford, CT has some nice Tee shirts for $13. postpaid. One has a nice silkscreen Original in yellow, black and white on a greyish shirt. Phone them at 1-860-442-5182. Stephan has one of them on at http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cub4sale.htm Tell him you saw it here.
Hope to see you all back here now that we're up and running again ! !

Anton Rothbauer - 08:56pm Jun 15, 1998 EST (#605 of 800)
Anyone know if decals are available for 38in 2 and 3 blade decks and placing of them on decks? Thanks, anton@otherside.com Indiana

Gary Marshall - 09:43pm Jun 15, 1998 EST (#606 of 800)
I have a Cub Cadet Mod # 1810 that has developed an oil leak between the hydrostatic unit and the gearbox. Installed a new gasket along with Permatex yellow gasket adhesive. Now it leaks worse than ever. The local dealer is no help. Would be interested if any other owners have experienced the same problem and what they did to fix it. Thanks

Rick Goodman - 08:06am Jun 16, 1998 EST (#609 of 800)
Hi guys, remember me?
Gary , about your gasket problem, either the gasket got torn or moved during reassembly.The only gasket sealer we use on these is Permatex Hi-Tack on the side of the gasket without the self stick adhesive. Make sure all surfaces are CLEAN. Then put the self-sticking side of the gasket on the hydro.Then Hi-Tack both the gasket and the transmission surface and carefully set the hydro into place without moving the gasket. Tighten the bolts and you should have a good seal. Some sealants don't work real well with cork gaskets and I'll bet that was your problem. Let me know how it works out.
Finally got a little(and I do mean little)work started on the original and Spirit of 76.Took them both to a show a couple weeks ago as works in progress.Hey, It's a start!!
Later, Rick

Kenneth Updike - 07:18pm Jun 16, 1998 EST (#613 of 800)
MIKE....#612.....IH never made "high lift" blades for a 44" deck. If you make some, make sure that the blades are balanced, or you'll be buying alot of ST-745 bearings soon. I have a 44" on my 782 and it cuts great!! One trick I use is to paint the mower deck housing with graphite paint each year. This acts as a teflon coating so grass won't gum up and stick on the housing. We sell the bagging style (high lift) blades here (at C&G) for other sized CC mower decks, and I personally could not stand to operate any brand mower with these on. They ALL howl like a jet when you run them.
Another item you may wish to check is to see if the deck is level from front to back. If the front is tipped down too much any tall grass will be just pushed over and the blades won't reach it. Also, CC offers a weld on replacement front guage wheel set, to be used when the guage "skid" rings have worn down. These weld on where the "skid" rings were welded on. They do make a great difference in the quality of cut too. Finally check the rear baffle on the deck (looks like a long W) to see if its worn out or even there. This is an important piece on the deck too.

John Warrick - 02:42pm Jun 27, 1998 EST (#692 of 800)
Jerry @687 Two years ago I found Haban Manufacturing Co. in Racine, Wis. at (414)637-8388. I was looking for a sickle bar mower for a Bolens Husky 1050 garden tractor. The folks at Haban said they no longer make the mowers for garden tractors. I did find a shop who takes in Haban Sickle Bars from time to time which may fit you Cub Cadet. Try Ray's Mower Shop in Boyertown, Pa. at (610) 367-2078.

Deward Mitchell - 12:36am Jun 28, 1998 EST (#694 of 800) from Brigham City, Utah
I'm not sure if it was here or else where that someone was asking about a gang mower. There is one in the Northern catalog, their address is www.northern-online.com

Harry Bursell - 10:59am Jun 29, 1998 EST (#702 of 800)
Thomas @696 - Dave Holtmart is taking you in the right direction. One thing I'd suggest before you buy the gov. spring. The spring is usually connected in the second or third hole from the bottom on the throttle cable linkage connector. (I'm not sure which hole it connects to on the gov. arm itself - look for the worn hole) When the throttle cable is moved to idle setting the gov. spring should be completely relaxed and allow the gov. arm to move the throttle on the carb to closed position. Make sure the spring goes to relaxed position when the throttle cable is moved to idle. The spring should almost want to fall out of the connecting holes.
I've had problems here before. The spring connector at the end of the throttle cable must move freely with the throttle cable. It should have a small spring washer with a reduced shoulder bushing on the bolt holding it to the block. These parts allow the spring connector to move freely with the throttle cable. When the motor is NOT running and you push the throttle cable control from idle to high speed the spring should almost immediately show some tension and begin to move the gov. arm which in turn begins to open the throttle on the carb. This hole thing is quite tricky and very sensitive. Still with motor NOT running, when you are at full throttle the spring should show tension and pull throttle full open. I had a problem similar to what you describe when I put one back together after painting. If this solves your problem then your next step could be to set sensitivity of the gov. as identified in manual. Hope this helps. Harry

Kenneth Updike - 08:08pm Jun 29, 1998 EST (#709 of 800)
Harry...#708...The 82 series were the RED Cub Cadets(also the last series built by IH), and are excellent looking and running tractors. Some have the twin cylinder KOHLERS in them.

Joe Scott - 09:33am Jul 1, 1998 EST (#720 of 800)
I would love a back blade for my original. Does anyone have one for sale? Are there any plans out there for such an animal? Does anyone know anything about the cooling fins on the base of my K-161?

Bob Necker - 09:55am Jul 1, 1998 EST (#721 of 800)
Joe Scott: Check Northern Hydraulics for Category 0 and sleeve hitch implements to fit your Original. Sears also sells sleeve hitch blades and other attachments. You will need a three point hitch or a sleeve hitch adapter. There are ppl on this forum that have both kinds of hitches. Possibly you could get the schematic and build one. They are fairly simple and straighforward to fabricate if you have the drawings.

Joe Scott - 12:38pm Jul 1, 1998 EST (#722 of 800)
Thanks Bob. My cousin has a metal shop so I think we could build something. Does Northern have a web site? Does anybody know where I could get the drawing Bob was refering too? How long did IH build the original design Cub?

Bob Necker - 05:46pm Jul 1, 1998 EST (#723 of 800)
Joe Scott: You may see one of these sleeve hitch attachments at http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cubbrinl.jpg This particular one was manufactured by the Brinly Company and some were distributed through the Sears Roebuck Company in the 1960's. Maybe you can get a good enough idea from the pic to make one. Actually quite simple design . If you have questions about it e-mail me for more details.

bob mccammon - 11:35am Jul 3, 1998 EST (#726 of 800)
if you have HOME DEPOT STORES in you area they have the BRINLEY-HARDY IMPLEMENTS for CADETS

Bruce Slykhouse - 09:35pm Jul 4, 1998 EST (#732 of 800)
I attended the IH Collector's meet in Ohio today and picked up some sales literature for Cadet accessories. There have been several messages about these companies. Heres the address's on the brochures.
Brinly-Hardy Company
340 East Main St.
Louisville, Ky 40202
502-585-3351
Mars Industries Inc
5209 W. Broadway
Minneapoilis, MN 55429
612-537-8408

Tom Hoffman - 08:22am Jul 5, 1998 EST (#733 of 800)
FOR SALE; (Thinning out the doubles!) 1965 100 with fenders, 3pt. hitch, creeper gear, 8.50 rears, headlights and 38" deck. Good paint $1250. 1964 100 with 38" deck. Original condition $700. 1961 Original restored with many new parts and new tires $1500. LATER TOM

Bob Necker - 11:51pm Jul 7, 1998 EST (#766 of 800)
Joe Scott:
There isn't much hidden in the Cub Cadet site but one thing that doesn't have a link to, but you may be interested in, is the three point hitch spring assist assembly for an Original Cub Cadet. Someone wanted to see what it looked like at one time and I posted some photos and a crude drawing that I did to help them out. If you, or anyone else is interested in it you may view it at http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cuboom.htm If you have questions e-mail me and I'll try to answer. And to anyone that doesn't know, the correct hood decals for Originals are now ready for shipping. Details and an example may be seen at http://www.cybernet1.com/oldiron/cubpaint.htm Bob

Kenneth Updike - 09:17am Jul 13, 1998 EST (#818 of 823)
Bob....#814....Glad that you have confessed your sin, we wouldn't want to have to exile you to the "other colored" L&G forum on Voyager. For your pennance, you'll have 3 choices. 1.Repaint the Brand X machine Cub Cadet Yellow and White. 2.Buy me one of those rare Red & White painted Brand X L&G tractors. 3. Repeat 100 times "Hydros are superior to gear drives".
Harry...#816....At the Red Power Roundup held in Madison, SD last year someone had built a Cub Cadet Crawler and called it the model "00". I snapped a photo of it. It was a crawler sold by Northern Hyraulics???? that had the grille and hood from a Cub Cadet 100 added. A very, very, nice machine. Not a "cobble job" at all. It had a V-twin Briggs engine and even remote hydraulics.
*******Everyone intersted in seeing a Book printed on Cubs and Cub Cadets should contact Motorbooks International of Osceola, Wi. and tell them that you want one. (1-800-826-6600) This is the only way a book on these tractors will happen. If you don't tell them this is the book you want to buy, Motorbooks doesn't know what to print. I have tried to pitch this book, but was shot down and are doing a different book now on Modern IH tractors.

Harry Bursell - 07:15am Jul 13, 1998 EST (#816 of 823)
Bob and others - I really don't know how e-mail and other postings work but I just received mail from a guy named Randy who's Father has tracks on his Cub Cadet. He was wondering if I had any info. Well I don't and have never heard of them but they sure did sound interesting. I gave him the IH Cub page site address and told him of the Forum. Suggested many people would be interested and there were many experts I'm sure could help him. He then sent me a .jpg picture. If he doesn't make the site Bob I'll try to e-mail you the photo to post it. Wish I could find one of these. May not be as easy as puttin on chains but hey, looks like you could go anywhere.
Bob - on those rubber boots for the ball joints, they were also used on the linkage joints under the console on the Hydros. I wondered about these myself. I hadn't seen them used any place else. Harry

Steve Kennedy - 08:25am Jul 13, 1998 EST (#817 of 823)
Greetings from NC! I have been reading the forum with great interest since I have been using MTD Cubs for mowing for two years and just purchased a 1965 CC 100 with 10 hp Kohler and 3 point hitch and 42" deck with cast ends. The tractor is in great shape with just some minor work needed on details (I would be interested in air filter and engine decals). Does anyone know if seat cushions are available? I have a fair amount of work to do on the deck - are the parts still available to restore the IHC decks? My compliments to the contributors to this forum - I find the technical quality very good and the humor on the debates great! I look forward to sharing info with you.

Harry Bursell - 10:47am Jul 13, 1998 EST (#819 of 823)
Ken @818 - from the photo of the Tracker or Crawler, it's clearly an IH Cub Cadet. Based on the grill and original seat I'd make it to be a 124 with tracks and adapter added. Tracks appear to go over original tires with additional rollers or tires added and some type of tensioning device. Can't tell what Kohler is on it and hadn't seen Chrome Air Cleaner before. I'll send the photo to Bob this evening if I can figure out how over e-mail. (It's pretty hi-tech for me, seems to be one level over Hydros). Harry

Joe Scott - 12:59pm Jul 13, 1998 EST (#820 of 823)
Hi guys what beautiful weather were having here in Nortwest Michigan. Grow grass grow. Well I finally picked up that Original I posted about a while back. I took the parts that I needed to restore mine & have a bunch left over. I am willing to sell/swap the rest of these parts. Here is a partial list of main parts: Front grille casting,hood, original k-161s yes it runs & the governor works(I think it was Ted who inquired about the motor), original headlamps, fron frame, complete rear end,all kinds of goodies. E-mail me or post here for more details. Lets deal. Bob or whoever is in charge of decals, I need a complete set, hood, gas tank, aircleaner, the whole kit & kaboodle need something for your Originals, I hope, 'cause I'm sure by the time I get all of those deacals, we be talkin' some cash!! Happy mowing P>S> I know of a 127 ,I believe, that may be up for sale if anyone is interested, no idea of condition, year etc...

Kenneth Updike - 10:38am Jul 14, 1998 EST (#832 of 839)
Mike...#829....IH used AUTO-LITE (1940's-1950's) and later PRESTOLITE (1960's to mid 1970's including early Cub Cadets) brand batteries in thier Ag tractors and trucks. Around 1975 IH switched to EXIDE brand batteries. EXIDE is still the OEM batery source for IH. We at C&G don't sell EXIDE due to many problems we have had with them (poor service, many warranty problems). The totally sealed maintenence free EXIDE batteries IH had used in the 86 and 88 series AG tractors lasted on average, over 10 years, but these are no longer made. We now sell the DAY STARTER brand of batteries. I like the DAY STARTER because they offer a 3 year 100% coverage warranty (No monthly PRO-RATION here!!!!). NO OTHER battery MFG offers this length of warrranty!!!

Harry Bursell - 06:45pm Jul 14, 1998 EST (#838 of 839)
Bob - thanks for posting the photos of the Cub Tracker. They are Randy's at 831. He's hoping to get some information on the unit if anyone has any ideas where it came from, was it original, aftermarket, etc. (Ken, it's not a 100 make-over, got any other historical data about this?) One question I put to Randy - the before appears to be a Hydro with steering wheel (probably not used) and steel tray seat. The after looses the steering wheel and hydro control on the console and appears to have gear shift just forward of the fiberglass seat. Thought these photos might actually be 2 different units.
Well, whats everyone think. I don't know if anyone south of the Mason/Dixon would have much use. Randy is in upstate NY close to the border someplace and surely has use in the snow. (Hey, if the before picture is a Hydro, would it go faster on the snow??) Harry

Randy Coty - 07:49pm Jul 14, 1998 EST (#839 of 839)
Hi Harry.
well to help you out with the confusion. we took the tracks off a hydro and put it on a standard shift unit.. it made it much easier to operate. We would still like to find a Hi/Lo Range gear box for it.. if anyone knows who might have one for sale.. and as far as the steering wheel guys. your right it's not used. because part of the rails for the boogie wheels for the track actually goes over the front spindles.. and i live near Plattsburgh NY if anyone was interested.. well hope to find out more soon.. working on it :) Randy

Randy Coty - 12:54am Jul 15, 1998 EST (#841 of 848)
Hi Harry, well as far as the Axel goes. it's in the original location.. i have some better pictures of the machine with out the tracks in place but with all the other running gear. i will send them over to you.. might help satisfy your curiousity a bit, and as for the seat.. what it really needs is just the cover.. and for the models.. we have both machines still. so i have to go and take a look. and maybe come up with some Serial numbers for them both... but i do know one was a 125 from the decals on the hood.. and for the chrome Air breather.,. well that was my addition.. i did it at work. along with Powdercoating the rest of the components .. included in the track kit. you know got to help out dad once and a while :) Well hope to hear more from you guys.. i am making some really nice friends with this.. maybe i need to dig out one of the cadets and start restoring it for myself huh? and yes that one does have the 12hp Kohler engine. well i will send you some more pictures of it harry.. and hope to hear from you guys again soon. bye Randy

David Gallagher - 07:38pm Jul 15, 1998 EST (#849 of 857)
Has anyone discovered a method of preventing grass from sticking to the underside of the mower deck on my 129? I have tried paint, WD40, and nothing seems to work.

Mason Ridlen - 10:26pm Jul 15, 1998 EST (#850 of 857)
David @ 849 You might try a product called POR 15. It results in a hard, slick surface & is used for rustproofing & metal coating in the automotive world. Comes in black, white, silver & clear. Might be other colors by now. It's potent & will have to wear off your skin if you get some on you, but it is great for coating metal. It can be painted over if you want the Cub Yellow or White to keep the original appearance. Painting might not stop grass from sticking, however. Mason

Harry Bursell - 01:32pm Jul 16, 1998 EST (#854 of 857)
Hey guys - you probably think I sit around all day (and half the night) waiting for something to pop up on here. Well I don't, I really just check it periodically at my work since I use a PC most of the day.
Well here's one for anybody with 1978 and newer units. The front axle U shapped channel (welded to frame where the axle mounts) on my 1450 (circa 1978) has 2 concave type protrusions about 1" from the outside edges of the rear side of the channel. I can't see any reason for these and can't understand what assistance they may provide. They don't appear to be "dents" from the axle as the axle is flat or straight across at this point. Also, my other 1450 (circa 1976) doesn't have these, my 149 doesn't either. I've also looked at many other earlier units and they don't have these. My concern is 1 of these protrusions now has a split. I'll probably weld it when I go over the complete tractor and true the channel for the axle. I could pound the protusions flat again but they just don't look like they should be. Would anyone with 1978 and newer units please check to see if their U channel is flat across the rear side or has these protrusions? Or if anyone knows a cause or problem that occurs to cause these, would you please let me know? Thanks to all the contributors.
Brad @853 - I need to change 1 of these seals on my 1450. In checking the service manual it does indicate you can replace the seal by removing the "C" clip under the inspection cover and sliding out the axle, then removing the seal. If you need to replace the needle bearings or something more, you'll have to go farther into it. Since I haven't actually done this I hope someone else can verify the ease or difficulty in doing this. Thanks Harry

Brad Byers - 04:00pm Jul 16, 1998 EST (#855 of 857)
Harry @ 854: Thanks for the response. I'm going to wrench on it this weekend. I just needed to get my courage up. I wish I could help you on your 1450 situation, but I can't figure it out. My 122 started steering funny, and I discovered that the axle pivot in the center of the front axle casting had worked its way rearward (toward the engine) far enough that the front axle wasn't secured. I drifted the pivot pin back in place, but I still don't know what is supposed to hold it in position. It looks like it can eventually work itself loose again, so I'll keep an eye on it.
As always, if anyone has advice, I'm ready to listen. Thanks, Brad

Kenneth Updike - 04:55pm Jul 16, 1998 EST (#856 of 857)
Harry...#854...The U shaped holes on the later "Quiet Line" Cub Cadets were added, I believe, to allow you to access the front 2 engine oil pan bolts. Don't pound them flat or cut them out. These holes don't cause problems. Brad....#853...Don't forget to change the hydraulic oil in the trans when you replace the seal.

Harry Bursell - 06:40pm Jul 16, 1998 EST (#857 of 857)
Ken @856 - thanks, I'll take a look. I thought there must be a reason for them. They just didn't look like dents from something.
Brad @855 - hope you have enough courage now. I often need this type of little push. Let me know how you make out on the seal. As Ken suggested, you should change the fluid, since it will be mostly drained anyway, and by the book should be changed each year. On your front axle rocker pin, it's held in place at the front with a roll pin, look at the front raised shoulder where the pin is inserted. Harry

Kenneth Updike - 10:10am Jul 17, 1998 EST (#862 of 867)
Mike...#859...The 80 CADET lawn tractor you have is the replacement for the model 76. The 80 CADET was built in 1977 & 1978. These were IH's answer to the low end featured and priced tractors being sold by the discount competition. The CADET lawn tractor line was scheduled to be released by IH in 1967, but IH ran out of engineering manpower to produce a quality product on time, so...the CADET line was released in 1970 with the model 76. A really neat variation of this series are the SPIRIT of 76 CADET lawn tractor painted with RED-WHITE-BLUE colors, along with fancy striping and stars!!!! These are VERY collectible!!!!!!!
Harry...#860...The editor at MOTORBOOKS I'm dealing with is LEE KLANCHER. I've decided to do a book on IH tractors right now for them, and still keep looking for more CUB CADET info.(Like Mulder & Scully say; "the truth is out there") The folks at MOTORBOOKS told me that there is no interest in a book on CUB CADET Lawn & Garden tractors. What a bunch of #$*#!! Hey EVERYONE on this forum get busy and tell them this is what you want to buy...A book on the CUB/CUB CADET Line. Also, if anyone has some extra CUB CADET sales literature, or CUB CADET???? Let me know. I'm always looking. Run the BEST....Use a CUB CADET...and junk the rest!!!!!

Harry Bursell - 12:34pm Jul 17, 1998 EST (#863 of 867)
Brad @855 and Lance @861 - something sounds amiss with your units Lance. I'm not a shop guy but have changed the rocker pin on 122, 126, and 1450 units. These units have an axle U channel with 2 of what I would call thick washers welded on the outside center for the rocker pin to slide thru, and thru the axle. The early service manuals note these are a replaceable item. The welded thick washer on the front of all my tractors has a hole for a spring roll pin, approx. 1/8 or 3/16", to hold the axle pin from sliding or rotating. There is no pin hole in the rear thick washer. If I recall correctly the front roll pin hole has always been angled at approximately 45degrees from parrallel with the axle, which allows the pin to be driven out from the bottom and not interfere with the motor, or could be driven from the top if grill is removed. Lance, if the rear washer item on yours has a pin hole I would guess someone has replaced it with a hole version or non-original. Also, if you use a double roll spring pin (available from Cub) they tend to be near impossible to remove and generally won't fall out like cotter pins, or break or jam like a single roll pin. I also believe the front thick washer is about twice the thickness of the rear one. The rear would hardly have room for a roll pin and I'd be very hesistant to be pounding a punch around the aluminum or cast oil pan, which is very close to the rear thick washer on my 1450. I would also be hesistant to weld the rocker pin or a cover over it. I believe the rocker pin is a slightly softer steel to take the wear. I've never miked one but usually replace it at removal. The new one always fits tighter and I try to tighten the axle channel should it have opened slightly from true. I will take a look at these on my 149 tonite and let you know if anything is different. Hope this helps, Harry

Mike Tilton - 04:06pm Jul 17, 1998 EST (#864 of 867)
More info on my mystery Cub Cadet. Steve - I looked for numbers in the area you mentioned and nothing, but heres what I did find. So we know which right im talking about, if im sitting on the tractor.... on the right, upside down is "351530-R" just under that is the IH logo. On the left, also upside down, I found a raised tag attached with either 4 screws or pins that looks like..(*6*28*3*) asteriks are screws. Now looking at the cub web site if 351530 is the serial it's a 1970, if 6283 is the serial it's a 1961. Any ideas anyone???? steve?harry?bob? Now for the engine. I removed the gas tank and engine marked JAY-12 TAMPER is a "WISCONSIN AIR COOLED GASOLINE ENGINE". Did IH ever offer that as an option?????. looking at the web page, my cadet looks like the one shown restored, including the oil bath air cleaner, and the hood decal matches the one the kids are playing on. thanks for any help... Mike

Mike Tilton - 04:33pm Jul 17, 1998 EST (#865 of 867)
More... went to garden tractor pulling web site, the 1961 cub pictured on the Cub Cadet web site is also there and lists that it has a wisconsin engine.

Steve Kennedy - 04:40pm Jul 17, 1998 EST (#866 of 867)
Mike @ 864,865 - I'm pretty sure the number on the casting that is stamped upside down is simply a casting or part number for the housing. On my 100 the serial number is on the small pad I described which is just towards the front of the housing from this upside down casting number. It is pretty faint and quite a bit smaller than the casting number. Also the decal you described sounds like a 70 or 100. I can't quite make out the model number of the one on the web page with the kids playing on it but it may be a 100. As to the Wisconsin engine hopefully Bob or ? can speak to that.

Bob Necker - 05:33pm Jul 17, 1998 EST (#867 of 867)
Mike that number you are referring to on the left side is probably not a "stamped" number but rather a cast in "raised" number. Same for the number on the left. I believe that a closer inspection will reveal that the "screws" are, infact, not screws but part of the casting itself. I have been told that this is the cast date. I cannot verify that but it sounds logical.
A crucial bit of information that will identify your tractor is the drive system. Does the drive shaft run under the tractor and connect to the engine crankshaft with Vee belt (Original) or run directly in line with the engine crankshaft to the reduction gear housing (all others).
The serial number on an Original will be found stamped on the reduction gear housing going vertically from "upper to lower" on the forward portion of the housing.
See what you can do with this information to ID your machine. Look for the tag on the fan housing to get engine numbers. It is possible that someone has applied Wisconsin decals on a Kohler engine. Not that I have seen everything, but I have never seen a Wisconsin engine with this type air cleaner, or seen one on a Cub Cadet that came that way from the factory. Bob

Harry Bursell - 11:57pm Jul 17, 1998 EST (#868 of 871)
Mike @865 and Steve @866 - I'm not sure I can contribute much but I believe the unit the kids are playing on is either a 102, 122 or 123. It has the square type fenders and the padded fiberglass seat. I believe the model 71 was the 7 or 8hp unit during the 122/123 era. It had the C spring and metal seat and fenders were optional but not sure if they were the square type or rounded (think they were square). Mike if you double click on the statements about the "70 and 100" on the Cub Web site you'll see pictures of these 2 units. They have a "C" spring and metal seat, rounded fenders, and foot rests that are NOT connected with the fenders. I also think the front cast grill piece is a different shape thatn the 122/123 style. Again if you look at the unit the kids are playing on the grill has a slight curve 3 or 4 inches from the top, and if you look at the 70/100 the grill appears to be straight up and down. I've only ever seen one 100 so I can't add much. Hope this also helps in your determination, except many of these parts, even the rear ends, could be interchanged from one era to the other. Bob's info on the drive shaft is probably the most definite identifying feature. Harry

Harry Bursell - 12:14am Jul 18, 1998 EST (#869 of 871)
Mike and Steve - curve is towards the bottom (not top) of the cast grill on 122/123. Also the grill insert on the 122/123 was a grate type similar to the grates in a gas grill. The 70/100 appear to have a mesh metal grill insert slightly heavier than screen. Harry

Ken Wagenknecht - 02:31am Jul 18, 1998 EST (#870 of 871)
currently 3 cubs, 2-129's 1-128 For sale or trade: Headlight mounting rings for a 122. (2 inners/2 outers) Looking for a spring assist for a 129/128. Also need chrome lift handle for same model.

BRIAN STIMPLE - 02:43am Jul 18, 1998 EST (#871 of 871)
Can anybody help? I bought a 1250 and a 1450 (plus numerous replacement parts and too many man hours) and still don't have anything to mow the lawn with. The 1250 needs an overhaul but the 1450 seems to be pretty sound enigne wise. The problems is this 14 hp tractor bogs down in thick grass which a 72 I used to run would walk thru without any problem. Govenor? carb adjustment? Would really appreciate any suggestions-(wife is getting mad) Thanks.

John Simpson (Ft. Lauderdale) - 03:14pm Jul 18, 1998 EST (#872 of 878)
Well, after replacing the head gasket, resurfacing the head, replacing the spark plug, rebuilding the carburetor (twice), replacing the condensor, and setting the pointsd, I finally figured out why my 128 would only run on ether! These things don't run on diesel!!!

Harry Bursell - 11:57pm Jul 18, 1998 EST (#873 of 878)
Brian @871 - I'd try a governor sensitivity adjustment. Hope you have a service manual where it's pretty well detailed.
John @872 - thanks for the tip on correct fuel. How's she run now anyway.

Harry Bursell - 12:07am Jul 19, 1998 EST (#874 of 878)
Brian @871 - I should have mentioned making sure the points are set at .020 or better yet you have verified the timing. Then go to the governor sensitivity adjustments. If you don't have a manual come back here with your spring connections points. Harry

Tom Hoffman - 08:07am Jul 19, 1998 EST (#875 of 878)
Hey guys, long time, no talk!! Been busy in the wonderful world of construction, not much time for fun thhings. Picked up a 124 just the other day and needed to make some carb adjustments on it. I noticed that it has only one adjustment screw! It is a WALBRO carb. Here is the question, what is the original brand carb for this tractor? Is the WALBRO carb interchangable with a carb on a 100? The one on 100 is wore out, the engine rolls from the throttle shaft being so worn. Not much action on #590, picking up misc. parts when I run across them. Gettin' ready for the "Winter Project". LATER TOM

Clayton Rowland - 04:50pm Jul 19, 1998 EST (#876 of 878) Wildwood MO
Hi all, Does anybody have a line on a used crank for a 149 K321 kohler w/ stock pin diameter??? The kohler dealer says this part is no longer available. What a shame. I had some corespondence with the kohler people, (they have a web sight http://kohlerco.com/engines.html) The Kseries engines have been discontinued because of EPA regs. They are still making parts and replacement engines though. (not the crank for a cub) They have a similar unit the magnum engine. I cant tell the diference between the two blocks (no points) but they are apperently different. OH well just thought I would share that.

David C - 07:10pm Jul 19, 1998 EST (#877 of 878)
I have whats left of 4 Cub Cadets to part out, models 71,105,106 & 123. I have no engines or parts. Also have a few owners manuals & 3 Cub Cadet 3 ring binders with parts books, each binder covers 14 to 18 models. email direct at DeeCee@dekalb.net David

John Simpson (Ft. Lauderdale) - 09:29pm Jul 19, 1998 EST (#878 of 878)
Harry @873: Great!

Harry Bursell - 11:04pm Jul 19, 1998 EST (#879 of 890)
Dave Holtmart @570 - this is going back a ways, but wanted to let you know I pulled 3 steering wheels today using your method of a nut and bolt, hammer and up pressure with legs on wheel. It worked slick, really great, etc. I didn't bugger any threads or chip or crack the wheel as I had been with a puller. Hey guys, this is the way to remove your steering wheels. Suggest you print a copy of 570. Thanks again Dave. Harry

Harry Bursell - 11:08pm Jul 19, 1998 EST (#880 of 890)
Clayton @876 - Hope someone will identify the differences in the K Series and the Magnum Series. I had thought besides the electronic ignition the Magnum was aluminum with a cast iron sleeve. If the Magnum crank won't work in a K series there must be other differences. Maybe Ken Updike or others can fill us in. Also an earlier message noted you can turn the crank .010. Harry

Brian Stimple - 12:47am Jul 20, 1998 EST (#881 of 890)
Harry at (873) and (874)- Thanks for the suggestions. I have checked the timing and points gap. I have also checked the valve tappet clearance. I do have a k series manual and will try the governer adjustment. I did notice one thing I thought was unusual, when I shut the engine off all of the fuel in the fuel line to the carb drains into the carb. Is this usual?
On another note my wife got to drive her dad's original in an antique tractor show today (we're hooked now). For an excellent show It's Camp Creek Threshers in Waverly NE this time every year. The equipment parade lasted over 2 and 1/2 hours!

Harry Bursell - 07:26am Jul